DaveTN

I walk my Doberman all the time carrying a .308 panther with two extra magazines. I’ve never had anyone bother me. Why is it not practical?

I wouldn’t question the owner about it. And I wouldn’t consider that sticking my head in the sand; I would consider it respecting the rights of the business owner (the only one that has any rights in this case). Any owner that would post a sign banning any group without understanding the consequences is ignorant and deserves to lose his business. But then I’m pretty sure that anyone that would post a “no firearms†sign has their reasons for doing it. I wouldn’t want to listen to the liberal anti-gun ramblings that might follow.

Did he go to jail?

This can't be true! Say it ain't so Joe, say it ain't so.

I love stainless steel guns for that very reason. There isn’t much I can’t fix.

Good advice here; I’ll add mine. Taking a semi-auto in and out of your pocket with gloves on will get you shot. You might want to look at a revolver. A .357 revolver will shoot either .38 or .357. .38 is a good round with not a lot of recoil, .357 is a great round if you can handle it. Check out the J frame Smith and Wesson or even better a 2.5†K or L frame if you can find one. I would recommend that you look at steel or stainless steel and stay away from aluminum, scandium or titanium. The laser sight is not a bad idea. Should you need to use a firearm you will not have time to use fixed sights. You should practice point instinct shooting. You should be able to place all your rounds from the 7 and 15 yard line in a silhouette target without the use of sights. Sights are for target shooting. On a different note…. You should call your local Police Department (on the non-emergency number; not 911) ask for the detective bureau, and give them the information about the guy in your complex. You don’t have to make a report or have an Officer come out if you don’t want to. Just tell them you want to give the information and they can do with it what they want. I worked a rape task force on a serial rapist. One of the biggest problems we had in catching the guy was that people didn’t call when they saw a suspicious person. This guy may be harmless, but you never know. Get your carry permit, get some training and practice….. a lot.

Randy, you are correct if you reduce it down to the simple question of whether or not you are justified in using deadly force; then your description applies for all 50 states. But Police officers are trained in shoot/don’t shoot scenarios for a reason. The fact that you are justified in using deadly force doesn’t relive you from all criminal or civil liability. The fact that you are observing an armed robbery at the local quick mart doesn’t give you the right to start blasting away. If you kill the perp all is good. If you cause a gun battle that ends in the death of an innocent person; all is not good. Not only will you be devastated financially but you stand a good chance of being charged criminally if it is determined that your actions were reckless. People should fully understand the legal ramifications of their actions and hopefully they could be explained to them by someone from the office that would be deciding if charges would be brought. Or you could just take the “Better to be tried by 12 than carried by 6.†attitude and roll the dice. Because after all leaving your family bankrupt or alone while you spend time in prison is no big deal.

I would say that it may matter in the civil case, but it probably won’t matter to most prosecutors in a criminal case. If you are being charged criminally there are some questions as to the legality of the shoot; not the ammo you used. How many times have you seen on a forum “I use Glaser’s in my carry gun!� Probably the worst possible round you could choose for carry. So why do people use it? First off they are clueless to what it is or what its application is. But more importantly there were attempts to outlaw the Glaser….. That automatically makes it one bad azz carry round. Anything that a civil trial lawyer can do to make you look bad; he will use. Off the shelve factory ammo for me; it’s been proven time after time there is no better ammunition for ending the threat than what is generally available. He’ll take a shot at my Hydra-shoks, but that’s a lot easier battle to defend than Glasers or fragmentation rounds. (And a lot better round)

True. You may be the best firearms instructor in the state and I mean no disrespect to you when I say that unless you are a lawyer specializing in criminal law in Tennessee your interpretation of the law carries no more weight than mine…. Which is none. As a Police Officer I saw differences in what a Prosecutor would bring to trial from one county to the next. Laws are impacted not only by the written law, but by case law. I wouldn’t seek out a criminal lawyer for firearms training and a person shouldn’t base their decision of when deadly force can legally be used based on legal interpretations of a firearms instructor. The most important decision a person may have to make in their life is whether or not they are justified in the use of deadly force; they should have the best legal advice available to them in making that decision. Once they make that decision the outcome may well be based on how well you have done your job.

+1. You can be arrested for anything. I don’t want the Police called on me for anything; I want no interaction with them whatsoever. I respect the rights of the business owner even if I don’t agree with them. Get the legislature to pass laws removing any civil liability the business owner has for something you do; and watch some of these signs disappear.

That’s not a popular opinion, but it’s the one I have also. From the answers to questions on gun forums it doesn’t appear that the laws governing the use of deadly force, civil liability, and the possession and transportation of firearms are covered much. I know that you can only pack so much info into 8 hours, but someone from the local Prosecutors office should be at the classes to field legal questions.

I don’t have a budget. I will be looking for something to fill the AK hole in a military rifle collection. I won’t be firing an AK much, but want it to function properly. I want it to appear as the original AK would have. For example, wood not a plastic stock. I have an 03 Springfield, M1 Garand and M1 Carbine. My .308 Panther is filling the AR role right now. I think my next addition needs to be a K98 Mauser, and then maybe an AK. The M14 might be a problem also.

I have a military rifle collection and at some point I will need to add an AK. I’ve never really had an interest in them and don’t know much about them. I would want something representative of the weapon that foreign militaries used. But I would assume that all of those were full auto weapons and the only thing I would be able to get would be an AK clone. (Without doing the whole class III thing) Is that a safe assumption to make?

And so you are going to show her a thread on a gun forum with a bunch of gun nuts saying that momma don’t have jack to say about it; and this will convince her? BTW.... Momma will always be boss.

Money. So that when they pass a law that you have to qualify with each weapon you decide to carry; there will be a record.

I think what the range is offering is a good idea. It gives someone an opportunity to maybe get some help or tips on a gun they may not be real familiar with. Training is always a good thing. But I’m a realist. I just think that believing that this class will help you in court is laughable.

As a former cop (although not from this state) I would say, no. There is no requirement to notify a Police Officer of anything you have in your car…. And he doesn’t care.

And the civil lawyer will counter that with Prima fascia. If you shot an innocent; you were not in control of the weapon or the situation. Unless of course you shot through the bad guy.

I take it to mean that it fulfills the same requirements as any other class, but you still have to do the paperwork and meet the other requirements. Background check, finger printing, etc.

No kidding. Don’t use WD-40 on a firearm.

I haven’t heard of any that are free; that would be cool. Mt Juliet Police Department does one that is $25 for residents. http://cityofmtjuliet.org/chsc.htm

You are bouncing around here Mike, and I’m not sure I can keep up. DA’s deal with criminal cases. Civil liability is civil court. Different sets of rules. I’m lost on where you are getting this “Bait for the DAâ€. You asked about if you only shot the bad guy. The DA could give a rolling rip down a razor blade what gun you used, what training you had, or what ammo you used if you are justified in using deadly force. A lawyer (not the DA) will bring all these things into question if you shoot an innocent. Whether you were legally justified in shooting or not.

VT was an “active shooterâ€. Due to the recent school shootings most Police departments have changed their tactics from “securing the scene†to the first responders engaging the shooter immediately with deadly force. Every case will be different. If someone had engaged Cho in the hallway before he had his big body count and killed Cho and an innocent student, the courtroom scene would not be the same as if someone shot him after his body count and at the same time killed an innocent student. Maybe you do, but I certainly am not in the same league as a national gas chain or retail store. Your home or your homeowners policy is going to pale in comparison to what they will be asking for in a wrongful death from your decision to engage a bad guy. Referring to the DA you are back in the criminal court. If you shot the bad guy the only question will be if you were justified or not. The DA will not care how you were trained. Now if you are being charged criminally with reckless conduct your training will be called into question.

We are talking civil here; not criminal. If an innocent person is dead there was no “accidentâ€. A jury will have hours or days to decide what other action you could have taken. And they will come up with many; none of which will include shooting an innocent person. As pro “deadly force†as this forum is you are going to 80% of the people wanting to give speeches about what you did wrong and how with all their knowledge and training the outcome would have been much different. So what do you think your chances would be with a jury? The obvious person to blame here is a dirt bag that has no money. The jury will want to give the innocent person or their family a payday. That is going to come from you and the really “deep pockets†if you happened to be standing in a business when the shooting occurred. The fact that you are not arrested does not necessarily let you off the hook. I doubt that being destroyed financially would be much fun. I’m not saying that I believe this “add a gun class†will help you any; I am only saying that in “good shoots†innocent people don’t get shot.

Criminally it won’t make any difference. But if you try to shoot a perp and kill an innocent bystander the lawyer for the family of the innocent person will hammer on the jury to increase the “punitive damages†they are already awarding because you were not qualified with the weapon you were carrying.