DaveTN

I remember when some of the "experts" we have now were new on here and asking questions because they barely knew which end of the barrel the bullet came out. Now we don’t chit.

I have no idea who Todd Green is. How does that impact my 40 years of firearms experience?

I’d go with the .38 revolver, great choice if she can handle it. But I don’t think I would give one of my parents a Rossi.

If I had security cameras recording burglars in my house ,obviously they would take my computers. That’s the end of the security video. I know there is an option for on-line storage, but I figured that was expensive. What about a wireless external hard drive hidden in the house somewhere? Is that an option? Besides scaring them off I want every opportunity to catch them and have them put in jail. Guess it’s the former cop in me.

It’s what training and choices are all about. Life’s tough, get a helmet. Run that scenario through your head and tell us how it ends.

Here is what the "Main Man" had to say about that...

Tell him to open the cylinder and look on the frame at the front of the cylinder for the model number. It will be a number like 29-5. On a Smith & Wesson the first number is the model number (29) the second number after the “dash†is the engineering release number. (Dash 5) We also might be able to tell what it is from a serial number.

Of course Police Departments are profiting off the drug trade. If you can convict them, take their cars, trucks, cash, homes…. Seize it all…. I don’t care. But if you can’t convict them of a crime; taking their property or money amounts to theft. It is wrong, and everyone in the law enforcement community knows it’s wrong.

He was trained enough to flip the safety but he was stupid enough to stand at the end of a hallway, in the open, pointing a rifle at cops? But that’s all non-sense its mere speculation on both our parts. The fact remains that he pointed a gun at Police Officers that were in uniform and yelling they were the Police. I don’t care if he was the Pope, he made a fatal mistake and he paid for it with his life. I thought I read they had a Doctor with them; He pronounced the guy dead. If you believe what you read the guy was hit with 60 rounds of .223. (I read that the coroner said 22.) I don’t believe for one second that a bunch of cops would have refused medical treatment if the guy was still alive. But it does make for a good story doesn't it? A good friend of mine got jumped on a domestic violence call by a guy that was trying to take his gun. When they were fighting over the gun the perp pulled the trigger and shot an Auxiliary Officer. Another friend of mine was coming through the door as the perp got control of the gun and was going to shoot the first Officer. The second Officer shot the perp six times with a .357Mag; twice in the head. The perp was dead before he hit the floor. So what was the controversy? The fact that the investigators would not allow the body to be removed until several hours later because they were doing a crime scene investigation. They guy shot one cop and was in the process of trying to shoot another, and someone is worried because his body can’t be removed? Boo Frigin hoo. Once they are in position to go through the door; they want everyone to know it. Why would that not add up? Probably makes the cops a little more on edge also wouldn’t you think?

It was the Police that released that information; they are the only ones that could have known that. What are you suggesting? You have an HCP don’t you? When a thug pulls a gun on you, will you wait to see if it fires? My first thought was that this guy got firsthand experience of the adrenalin rush of a gunfight and he simply forgot to the flip the safety off. That may have saved a cops life.

Are you freakin’ kidding me? Anytime you enter a home you are ready for a confrontation They entered and were engaged by a suspect armed with a semi-auto rifle. Several Officers shot the suspect before he could fire. Turning their backs? Not professional? Short of calling him on the phone and seeing if it was a convenient time for him to step outside;what would you have done? I’m sorry, but this guy was suspected of being part of a home invasion crew, and he engaged Officers in an armed encounter. He lost…. Sorry for his family he made the wrong decision, but I haven’t seen anything yet to led me to believe the cops did anything wrong. DISCLAIMER: I’m biased; I’ve been on those entry teams. If you want to lead the thug life you had better know that when the cops are yelling “Police… Search Warrant!†picking up a rifle will cost you your life.

There is no better weapon for your situation; there are only weapons that hold more rounds. Five shots of .357 Mag is devastating.

You don’t need the Castle Doctrine to protect you in an armed robbery. If an armed robber pulls a gun on you and you shoot them; you are justified, and you probably won’t get sued. If you miss him and shoot an innocent bystander you and the business are going to be sued and you could be charged criminally if you are reckless. Will it matter what training you had? It might affect punitive damages, but the end result shows you didn’t have enough training or enough experience. Training is a good thing; get all you can get. Will it protect you from the consequences of a bad shoot? No, but it might keep you having a bad shoot.

Smith & Wesson M&P. Full size frame, doesn’t come in pink, Don’t know if it will make your son drool; what does he carry? Not particularly hard to rack the slide. Just lock it back and then hit the slide release to chamber a round. One of the very few times you will be able to buy American made and buy the best without paying more. Better made than most and in the same price range… $500.

Only on TGO can a carry thread turn into a comparison of 7-11 coffee to Starbucks coffee.

Both sides agree that he was pointing a rifle at them. One side says it was an AR the other side says it was an AK….. Like it matters. The video shows that they arrived in a huge Police vehicle, the siren was blaring, The Officers were in normal SWAT uniforms, they were yelling they were the Police. He chose to respond to that by pointing a rifle at them. I would have fired. (Based on the info given)

Video, documents answer questions about SWAT raid - KGUN9 On Your Side, Tucson News, Weather & Sports http://reason.com/blog/2011/05/27/what-does-the-swat-marine-data

I’m not suggesting that you wait so long it gets you killed, or that you are required to. Whether he was armed really isn’t important, there is no requirement that an intruder is armed. The first question I had when I read your scenario was; who is it? Was it truly an intruder? Or was it a family member or someone else that has normal access to your house? As OhShoot pointed out you can't execute someone simply because they are in your home, and that is not what the Castle doctrine is about. You come home and find the 12 year old neighbor kid burglarizing your house. As you enter the back door he runs to the front door and is trying to get out when you shoot and kill him. You argue that “Castle Laws†protect you. Good luck with that. You enter the courtroom with the presumption that you were justified. The DA is free to tear that justification down and send you to prison if he can. I always need to identify my target before I fire. If I can’t I seek cover until I can. That’s just how I was trained.

Wants the alternative? You can object all you want, and most people that are the subject of a search do object, but they do it vocally not physically. If you cross the line to resisting or obstructing you will be arrested on those charges. If you pull a gun on the Police, you are at the very least going to jail, and more than likely someone is going to die. You cannot resist Police doing a search and you cannot resist arrest simply because you don’t think the Police have met their requirements. The purpose of these rulings is simply this… We have a legal system, not a justice system; there is nothing “just” about it. Mistakes are made, innocent people are arrested. But it’s the best system we can come up and it is continually evolving. The legality of an arrest or search will be argued in the courtroom, not on the street with physical violence. It seems to me that everyone here is fine with a warrantless search or entry if it protects the life of an innocent person, and not the protection of evidence. The courts disagree. And in most of the cases where someone was killed there was a warrant signed by a Judge. There was in the Lebanon case, they just had the wrong house. There also was in the case where the guy pointed a gun at a SWAT team.

Generally speaking…. Castle Law removes duty to retreat and gives you the “innocent until proven guilty†standing that you should already have; but don’t. It’s not… “He was in my house so I killed him.â€

No.

In a perfect world that is what would happen. But we live in a world where even the court can’t make a dirt bag pay when they don’t have any money. Anyone that carries a gun should know that if you shoot someone there is a very good possibility that it is going to get expensive if there was any doubt surrounding your shoot. That’s why you have a plan to makes sure that doesn’t happen to you. My plan is very simple. Would a reasonable person (That means a Jury that has spent a week looking at what you did and what you should have done) believe that you were in danger of immediate death or great bodily harm? It’s just yes or no, and you better be able you answer it. In the recent question the Father-in-law should be asking himself if his son-in-law has had enough training, both situational and legal, to risk his business on. If anyone is under the impression that “Castle Law†creates some type of "free fire zone "anywhere, including your own home; you are mistaken. If you are going to rely on “Castle Law†to keep you out of prison or from being bankrupted; you should understand it.

There is nothing in the state of Tennessee that says you can’t be sued. (That I have ever seen) There is a law that says if you are sued and it is determined you were justified the court can award you a judgment for your costs. But that doesn’t mean you will get paid back.

They can sue either one of you, and if you shot someone they would name you both in the suit. The fact that you aren’t charged isn’t a ruling you were justified. Who is going to “Find†your shooting was justified if you don’t go to court? The attorneys will go after the “Deep Pocketsâ€, I’m guessing that’s your Father-in-Law.

Keep an eye on the CMP forum. I was going to go this weekend, but according to the guys that went, there’s just not much there to pick from.