DaveTN

I content that you have a responsibility to not be in that situation. I content that Zimmerman was interfering with Treyvon Martins rights and therefore his self-defense claim is without merit. Zimmerman did not seek medical attention; therefore the back of his head was not bashed in. This old BS of “you can die from being in a fight†is ridiculous. Sure it can happen, I could also win PowerBall but it’s very unlikely. If you feel the need to kill someone that is attacking you in a situation you created; that’s fine. But I think it needs to be clear that unless you are an innocent victim (you come before the court with clean hands) a jury will be deciding your fate.

I agree. I think fear is driving a lot of the drama and personal attacks. Some want desperately to believe that if someone is kicking their azz they can just pull their gun and kill them. I contend that if you instigated the attack you can’t. I guess we will see how it pans out in Florida.

Hey, with your extensive travels through the Florida legal community can you fill us in on Angela Corey? She says she is not likely to need a Grand Jury to make the decision for her. So is she going to just come in and shut this thing down cold, or is there a possibility this may actually be a crime in Florida and she is going to proceed without a Grand Jury?

Granted. We also lost the requirement of any escalation of force. We go right from a fist fight to a gun. I don’t think an innocent victim should have that requirement, but if you are going to go out trolling the neighborhood and engaging perceived bad guys, you should have some type of less lethal device just like the cops do.

What power spotting scope would be required to see a target any more clearly than a 6.5-20X40 Leupold VXIII?

I’ve never claimed to be an expert on law, because I don’t think there is such a thing. The Attorney General of the United States is supposed to be the best we have to offer. And look at who we have and who we have had in the past. Apparently the people that are qualified and would be good at it don’t want that job any more than those that are qualified and would make a good President want that job. But I do know an injustice when I see it.

Yes, from what is being posted here by experts on Florida law, she wouldn’t have anything to charge him with and that would be a quick decision. If those experts are wrong, she needs to file charges and get on with the trial before the wait causes more problems in the community.

Looks like we may not have to wait for a Grand Jury hearing to know if there will be a trial or not.

I forgot to ask about that. Someone at work told me that a phone records check showed she was not on the phone with him at the time. But I can’t find that information in any of the stories. That’s a pretty easy fact to verify.Was she or wasn’t she?

So if you are accosted on the street by a short fat man with a gun, you have a duty to retreat? They couldn’t have got into a fight because Zimmerman grabbed him, punched him, or was using racially charged slurs?

That’s all I have said is that I want to see a trial. I don’t have any ax to grind with anyone involved in this case, I don’t have a problem with shooting criminals, I carry a gun and I think everyone has the right to do so (although the state disagrees with me on that). I have said the facts in this case that are not in dispute justify a trial. Some here won’t even acknowledge the facts that we know. Let’s throw another Latin term out there; Prima Facie. “At first look†or “on its faceâ€. That is how I would present the case to the Grand Jury. The case needs to be answered in a trial. 1. Trayvon Martin was in a place he had a lawful right to be. 2. There is no evidence he had committed or was involved in any illegal activity prior to his encounter with Zimmerman. 3. His peaceful journey was interrupted by someone that had no legal authority to stop or detain him. 4. As a result of that interruption he is dead. Now of course that doesn’t mean an automatic conviction. Zimmerman has a right to argue that at some point his role changed from perp to victim. Only two people know when and if that occurred; one is dead. A jury of Zimmerman’s peers should make that decision after having all the evidence presented to them by professionals; not the media. We don’t know the details of what happened at the point when Zimmerman claims he became the victim. Did he grab Trayvon? Did he hit him? Did Treyvon hear the racial slur? What else did he say to Trayvon? Was Trayvon scared and fearing for his safety? Would a reasonable person believe Zimmerman was in fear of death or great bodily harm? What does the autopsy report show? What will a jury conclude from watching the video of Zimmerman’s interview? Why did the investigators ask the SA to charge Zimmerman, and why did they not act? I heard the audio of the 911 call. I also heard it enhanced to clearly hear the racial slur. Will the jury get to hear it? Who knows? But it is important for a couple of reasons. Did Trayvon hear it, and if so what impact did it have on him? I remember one of the forum members saying that he was walking through a parking lot someone yelled “Hey you old white MF†(or something like that). Does that justify the use of deadly force? No, but it would be critical to show both his and the perps state of mind if something had happened. It’s also important because if the state fails to take this guy to trial or he is acquitted; it opens the door for the Feds top step in on a civil rights case. Do I agree with double jeopardy? No I don’t, and that is what that is. But most folks were okay with it when California acquitted the cops in the Rodney King beating and the Feds stepped in and sent them to jail on civil rights violations. I also find it hard to believe that this young man could hold Zimmerman’s head and beat it into the ground without Zimmerman being able to break his hold. I’m 57 years old, over weight and out of shape, but I don’t think from what I have seen of the pictures of Trayvon I could not have broken his hold and got him off me. I guess if my hands were busy trying to get a gun instead of fighting back he may have been able to. Zimmerman’s what 28? And appears to be bigger than Trayvon. Does that not raise a question with anyone else? Am I trying the case here? Certainly I am; we all are. That’s what we do. This is an internet forum and we arm chair quarterback everything that is posted. I don’t see anything wrong with that as long as it remains civil. I can assure everyone that I have no dog in this fight or some hidden agenda. It’s a hot case right now, and it’s an interesting thread.

There is nothing personal about this or anything in my background that would cause me to want to see this go to trial any more than any other homicide. Is there something in your back ground that would make you think its okay to kill a kid that was defending himself? You took he time to type out an intelligent response. I’ve tried not to respond to the pin head’s that can’t put more than a couple of sentences together that are simply name calling or launching personal attacks because someone doesn’t buy their version of events. Is this where this discussion is going? I’m appalled at the number of people here that think this is okay. And I’m amazed at the number of people that are remaining silent. Maybe this thread has just run its course and no one wants to discuss it anymore….

An ATV. Just kidding… I would be interested in hearing what the pros have to say also. I was looking for something to use at 300 yards, and the price got up there pretty quick. I would think you would need some serious hardware for 1K yards.

Well of course you would, because you are well protected and it’s not your neighborhood that will get burned, or your neighbors that will get injured. Flexing your muscles to a crowd that is looking for any reason to start a riot will sure show them how tough you are.

“Stand your ground†was Florida’s buzz word for not having to retreat. Tennessee doesn’t need to pass stand your ground legislation because we don’t have a duty to retreat. No duty to retreat means that when Treyvon was walking down the street and was accosted by a stranger, he didn’t have to run or try to get away (although he did, according to Zimmerman); he could retaliate and try to protect himself. Unfortunately for Treyvon the perp had a gun. No one knows for sure how or why they got in a fight, but they did. Some want us to believe that because the perp approached Treyvon, Treyvon attacked him and brutally beat him, causing Treyvon to now become the aggressor, which justified Zimmerman killing him. That is the self-defense claim. Common sense tells me that is non-sense. Zimmerman got out of his vehicle after being told by the dispatcher that he did not need to follow Treyvon. You can hear him make a racial slur in disgust as he exits the truck. Did Treyvon hear it? I don’t know. But now Treyvon is approached by a guy that has been following him in a truck, got out, and Treyvon may have heard the racial slur and got scared. I don’t know. That may have caused him to fight for his life. Zimmerman claims Treyvon knocked him down and was beating his head into the pavement; so he pulled his gun out and killed him. Zimmerman’s friend (who is all over the press talking about what Zimmerman told him happened, but saying he can’t really say anything) is alluding to the fact that the gun may have went off accidently. So the question becomes, can you be the aggressor in what the victim may have perceived was going to turn into an attack, an unprovoked attack on someone walking down the street, and when they protect themselves you kill them? I say no, you can try all you want to claim self-defense when you have killed someone in a situation you started; but give a jury any reason to throw out the self-defense and you are gone to prison. I want to see a trial. We don’t get to see all the evidence and neither does the press. Treyvon’s autopsy results are sealed. Was he hit in the face? Was he grabbed by the arm when Zimmerman approached him? Did his hands show any indications of the terrible beating Zimmerman claimed? Were his hands covered in Zimmerman’s blood from beating his head into the pavement? We don’t know.

Are you implying it was me?

My opinions about his guilt or innocence mean nothing. You are the one that said you are an expert on Florida law and that what he did was okay. Why did the investigating Police Officers ask for an arrest warrant; did they not know the law? I didn’t sentence him to the death penalty; I’m not a “New Black Pantherâ€. I still want to know why the person that offered that reward hasn’t been charged… is that legal in Florida also? This is all happening because the States Attorney’s Office failed to do their job and the citizens are not going to stand for it. Sure, now they have decided to take it to a Grand Jury, but I’m not sure any justice will come from that. Only one side of the story will be told there. It may take the Feds steping in.

Robert, the facts I’m basing my opinions on are not in dispute. Treyvon Martin was walking down the street minding his own business, drinking tea and having some skittles; minutes later he was dead. Some azzhat neighborhood watch guy decided he looked suspicious so he stalked him, got out of his truck and chased him, called him a “f*@#ing coonâ€, got in a fight with him (according to you) and shot him to death. Treyvon Martin had no duty to retreat either. He had a right to “stand his ground†and fight his attacker. Unfortunately for Treyvon he brought a set of fists to a gun fight. This dirtbag couldn’t handle a 17 year old kid; he had no business out messing with people. And because he didn’t have the physical ability to take care of business he (and many others) feel that when he figured out he bit off more than he could chew; it’s okay to take out a gun and kill the kid. He’s wrong, and he’s going to find out just how wrong he is. Maybe you can identify with this guy because he’s a gun owner; I can’t. You can put any spin on it that you want, but if what you claim happened; I hope he is convicted and sent to prison. I don’t know, maybe I shouldn’t be so concerned with a trial. Even if this guy doesn’t go to trial, his life as he knows it is over. He’ll live in fear the rest of his life.

He got to live more years than his victim. He snuffed his life out at the age of 17 instead of taking an azz whipping. I bet right now he’s wishing he hadn’t had a gun on him. Everyone would more than likely be alive and he wouldn’t have a bounty on his head.

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Here… or in Florida? I guess in Florida it is legal to chase him down and kill him. Doubtful, but we have no way of knowing that. With a taser maybe or mace. Martin was 2 minutes away from still being alive. No, and I doubt he will have many financial hardships if he can stay alive. If he doesn’t go to prison he will make a lot of money off this case. (Interviews, Movie deals, whatever) He is already claiming PTSD (Of course he is ), maybe he can sue Martins family for even more money.

I don’t think anyone should be forced to be in the military and I don’t think there was ever a need for the draft. Yes, I served in the military and I wouldn’t want anyone working with me that was being forced to be there. Without E we would all be speaking either German or Japanese. Emergency care in a “life threatening†situation should never be allowed to be refused. If it isn’t life threatening they should be able to turn you away as long as they get no funding from state of federal government.

I haven’t said he is guilty. I have just asked for a trial. I’m not going to be told that this isn’t a crime in Florida, or that a Florida jury won’t convict him; that’s non-sense. The Police believed there was cause for an arrest warrant, and asked for one. The States Attorney is the one that wouldn’t prosecute the case. He may have had a change of heart; a Grand Jury will be convened April 10th. Although, as I have said before, a Grand Jury is only a rubber stamp for the SA. Depends on if he has decided if he wants this case to go to trial or not.

And I think that’s part of the problem here. Many people here are putting themselves in the shoes of the shooter because they have a carry permit. They want desperately to believe that they can use that gun any time they are in fear of getting their azz kicked and don’t have to worry about going to prison. Sorry, but that’s not how it works. I put myself in the shoes of the victim. If I’m walking down my street unarmed and someone jumps out of a truck and starts asking me questions, I’m going to tell them to GTF away from me. If they continue and get close I may well punch them out. I hate to think the fact that I may be winning gives them justification to murder me. If nothing else some may learn from this case. I don’t know what is going to happen to Zimmerman if he goes to trial; but I bet I know what will happen to him if he dosen’t.

We have no idea who started it; only that it happened.