DaveTN

We already had a terrorist attack by taking over or crashing airplanes. We are spending a tremendous amount of money to make sure it doesn’t happen again. The terrorists know that. Doesn’t it make sense to spend some of that money for security in some obvious other areas where the death toll could be as high or higher? I doubt the next attack will be from someone passing through an airport checkpoint to make their attack.

I'll use BryanP's list with some catagories added and what i use in those catagories. Small Revolvers S&W J Frame Model 36 Medium Revolvers S&W K Model 66, S&W L Model 686 Subcompact Semi Auto - .32 & .380 Split ball and a straw. Subcompact Single Stack Semi Auto - 9mm and up Kahr MK40, trying to get an M&P 40 Shield Subcompact Double Stack Semi Auto - 9mm and up Never seen a double stack I would call a Sub. Compact Double Stack Semi Auto - 9mm and up M&P 40C Full Size Double Stack Semi Auto - 9mm and up M&P 40 1911 SW1911 I added the full size double stack and the 1911 because I would bet the numbers eclipse some of those other categories. Simply because a full size double stack is without a doubt the #1 duty carry gun, and many are used off duty concealed. And 1911 is just a highly popular carry gun.

Let me say as someone that had to fly around the country for my job, choosing whether to fly or not is not an option for most people. Also, people flying 2500 miles to vacation with family for a few days do not have the option of driving. This isn’t about choices, just because you have to fly doesn’t mean you should be required to have your wife or children molested by a stranger with no probable cause for a search.

Robert Garcia specifically said he didn’t see Scott at the time he was shot. He saw him when he hit the ground and he had nothing in his hands. He said there was no gun only what he thought was a pair of sunglasses and a pen. I don’t see Robert Garcia’s testimony in the stories. The family had an attorney by then why did they not make sure Garcia testified? What do you think happened to the gun? Are all the other witnesses that saw it lying? If they are all lying why would they say it was in a holster? If you are implying the cops planted it, why would they leave it in a holster? The source you are quoting says: Is it legal to carry a gun in Nevada when you are so loaded you are stumbling and can’t function properly? Like TMF 18B I when I read the story that he was an Army Officer who was a West Point graduate things just didn’t sound right. He told a store employee he was a “Green Beret†and allowed to carry a gun. I was not in Special Forces and have never met a Green Beret, but I have worked around Navy Seals and Marine Force Recon. That statement didn’t sound like something the Special Forces Officers I knew would say to a civilian. From what I can tell he was not Special Forces. Lying about being Special Forces, refusing to leave the store, carrying a gun while intoxicated, ripping merchandise out of the package, acting bizarre; none of those things warrant a death sentence. But when you combine all of them with grabbing for a gun while cops have guns pointed at you; the outcome will not be good. It was a tragic outcome; but Erik Scott set everything in motion when he put that gun on intoxicated. Unfortunately he paid for that mistake with his life.

Within a couple of days of shooting.

Darn man, not even a little…

I don’t want the law involved in my healthcare anymore than it already is. My Doctor can ask anything he wants and I will answer honestly. But I don’t have to; I can give him any answer I like. And I assume that unless it is an emergency he can decided if he wants to be my Doctor anymore or not.

This. I stood guard in the ER on a guy that had just shot two of my fellow Officers and had then by shot. The nurses were in tears and told me that they would like to let him die, but they couldn’t. I told them we understand. They saved him. It was as emotional and draining on the ER staff as it was for us.

The gun was in an IWB with a single clip. I would assume it came out with the gun when he pulled it. The witnesses said he pulled the gun and pointed it at the Officers. Listen to the information transmitted to the Officers. It was calm, there was no “active shooter†implied. The dispatcher even said he had not threatened anyone and had not pulled the weapon; it was in the rear of his pants. The detail Officer even told the other responding Officers to kill their lights and sirens when getting close to the store. He said “let’s don’t get this guy any more excited than he already isâ€. They ask to start medical to stand-by. They secured the parking lot. The dispatcher told them the male inside the business is acting erratic, throwing merchandise around, possibly high on unknown drugs. She told them the suspect was being argumentative with the manager when ask to leave and told him he was a Green Beret and allowed to carry a gun. Again… I don’t know that the guy was going to try to shoot a cop or anyone else. But he was too intoxicated to function or follow directions, according to a witness he stumbled inside the store and his girlfriend caught him. The witness said that he said “I guess I really am messed upâ€. Another witness said he heard Scott say to his girlfriend that he shouldn’t be in the store when he was drunk. This wasn’t a case of a permit holder open carrying; this was a case of an intoxicated person acting irrational and armed with a gun. Scott strapped that gun on intoxicated and went out, he wasn’t legally carrying. How is this the cops fault? People are responsible for their bad acts; his cost him his life.

As I read the law it would be simple assault. 39-13-101 a misdemeanor. Aggravated assault is generally a felony and would involve a weapon or more “serious bodily injure†under 39-13-102.

Prohibition saw a marked rise in home invasions and armed robberies of innocent citizens? I can’t address that I don’t have a detailed knowledge of the crimes rates and who were the victims during prohibition. I thought it was mostly gangsters and criminal club owners that were killing each other. Well sure, I guess we could do that. There would certainly be an increase in violent crimes. So your answer is “That’s okay because there will be more cops to respond� By the time the victims can call the home invaders won’t be there and there may be dead victims at the scene. But yes, response times would be quicker. The only crimes I mentioned were murder, rape, home invasion, burglary and robbery. Are those crimes that don’t have “actual victims� You got me there. I’m not really sure how to respond to that statement because I’m not sure you are serious in making that comparison. EDIT: Oh and I almost forgot…. It’s a discussion; not an argument. Let’s keep it friendly.

I disagree. (2) Specifically includes those with an HCP, it does not exclude anyone. If a Judge without an HCP is excluded it must in another statute.

I agree with you Dennis. The SCOTUS may call the desecration of the flag freedom of speech, but I don’t. I think its worse though when American citizens do it. It may be legal to desecrate it if you own it, but if you don’t own it; it’s a crime. If I was a cop this case would get special attention from me, and I would hope the DA and the Judge feel the same.

I sure would be too. But last time I checked kicking someone azz wasn’t a felony..... but I may be wrong, thats why I asked.

Lester, thanks for your comments. People kill people to get drug money. Innocent people are killed when they catch or stumble upon people burglarizing their homes. Innocent people are killed when home invaders enter their homes. Innocent people are killed and maimed in street robberies and car jacking’s. All of these crimes will increase when you legalize drugs. Which of the above statements do you disagree with? Law enforcement keeps a lid on it. They are losing control in some big cities because they are simply overwhelmed. They see violent vicious crimes in some small cities because they don’t have the manpower to stay on top of the meth problem. I have no problem with doing away with the DEA. Take that $20 billion and give it to local law enforcement where it can do some good. Either that or put someone in charge of the DEA that could stop the flow of drugs into this county; that would be a tremendous help at the local level. I’m not a fan of any agency or department that can’t do their job. My point of view comes from having dealt with these animals. When I hear about giving up the drug fight I don’t picture my friend from work that wants to smoke a bowl while watching his tree hugger shows with his Green Peace friends. I picture the thugs that I have interviewed after arrest and I picture the 25 year old woman who was beaten and raped in front of her husband when they walked into their house after a shopping trip. The two brothers who raped her and beat both him and her needed money to buy drugs. The next day they killed a 90 year old woman in a home invasion. She wouldn’t shut up so they put a pillow over her face and suffocated her. One of the only pro-active tools to stop these animals is the fact that cops can target them when they know who they are, and they can send them to prison when they stumble on them during traffic stops. Take those tools away and we are all in more trouble than we are now.

Why would it be aggravated?

I don’t have a scoped handgun, but I have a handgun scope on an M1 Garand. I didn’t want to spend a lot of money until I found out if it would work. It’s a Simmons Prohunter 2-6X32, you can pick them up new for just over $100. It’s handled several hundred rounds of 30-06.

If I was a Judge and you came before me on the charge of carrying past a sign, I would ask you if you saw the sign and if you understood the intent of the sign. But we have an amazing amount of discussion about a charge that to the best of my knowledge has never been used. Unless something has been posted recently we haven’t seen any confirmable accounts of this happening. Usually the person is told to leave or they will be arrested for trespass.

Here’s more information on what happened. There are links to several days there. http://www.lasvegass...s-inquest-day3/ Also…. There are recordings on that site of an unknown caller to 911, a store employee to 911, and the entire audio of the dispatch and the units responding. I couldn’t make out much of the 911 recordings they are really lousy audio, but the dispatch audio is clear. It’s a typical man with a gun call, no one seems real excited, the dispatcher is calm and tells the Officers no shots have been fired, she tells them the man was advised the store has a no guns policy and refused to leave. There just is nothing out of the ordinary there up to the point of an Officer calling “Shots Firedâ€. I have to assume his gun was still in the holster because the IWB clip holster came with the gun when he pulled it. There are plenty of witnesses that said he pulled the gun and pointed it at the cop. There is just nothing here to suggest that this was anything more than a MWAG high on drugs, refusing to leave the store, and either unable to understand and follow instructions, or he intentionally committed suicide. Would you wait to shoot if you had a man pull a gun on you while you had him a gun point?

Two things would have to happen first for that to be an option. First, the state of Tennessee would have to recognize the right of all citizens to carry a gun. That could happen in the future. Second, if businesses were forced to allow carry; they would have to have absolute immunity from lawsuits. They are the deep pockets and the lawyers are not going to allow that to happen.

There is plenty of information in the story about the Coroner’s inquest. They only thing they are alleging now is what the caller said and how the situation was relayed to the dispatched Officers. I have seen absolutely no info on a recording or transcript about that.

Foul. You are violating rule #1. If we aren’t allowed to refer to the law; neither are you. Sorry, I didn’t make the rules. But it’s why you aren’t getting a lot of discussion.

The family has dropped their lawsuit against the PD, and filed a wrongful death suit against Costco and the employee that called the Police. Common practice when you don’t have a case. They will get an out of court nuisance settlement, the attorney will take most of that, and the case will be over. This is why businesses post. Costco did nothing wrong, but they will either have to go to court or write a check.

I don’t think this is off topic, if it is a mod or the OP can let me know and I will delete it. Let’s add this to the drug discussion. Guns are legal to carry for a small group of us, but your employer doesn’t have to allow them in the workplace. If drugs were made legal I’m sure employers would still drug test and still fire employees that can’t pads a drug test. So the guy that thinks he can smoke pot without any repercussions could only do that if his job didn’t have a drug testing policy and if he didn’t apply for any jobs that did drug testing as part of the application process. So it would only be okay for those that didn’t plan on holding down a job, were retried or self-employed. So don’t you think it would be just another drain on society and our economy?

A proper posting to me is one I understand the intent of.