DaveTN

Try a Smith & Wesson M&P.

You are quoting a case where the SCOTUS held in a 6-3 vote that the DUI checkpoints in question met the 4th amendment standard of reasonable search and seizure. It is not unlawful for you to avoid a DUI checkpoint. But if a chase car is free they will be on you like a fat kid on cake. How far do you think you can drive before committing a violation of the vehicle code? Don't drink and drive. The only people that will help you or be on your side is the ones you pay.

You are comparing civil rights to moral standards?   Doesn’t matter how you worded it you are implying that they don’t have a policy against murders, child molesters and those that commit domestic violence. Nothing could be further from the truth. They are a private social group; they don’t need a criminal conviction to ban someone. There are also jobs you can apply for that will reject you for criminal or immoral behavior whether you are convicted or not. You aren’t entitled to a job or membership in a social group.

Certainly they do. They require that you obey all laws; they do a background check, credit check, and even ask questions about your driving record.   

Man, with this new holster I don’t even notice my gun is there… Hey wait a minute!!!                                                                                       

I predict that you don’t see it destroyed. The parents and the Scouts run the BSA; not the counsel. I suspect they are about to find that out.

If you ever smoked weed and even talked about owning a gun; you are a thug.

With a name like "Wicked Wanda" and you not being able to run; I'd say its whatever she says it is.    

I didn’t see in the story what they said; did I miss it?

We can’t overthrow our government or start a new one when they do something we don’t like; the scouts and their parents can do just that to their organization. I don’t think the majority of the scouts, parents, or churches, will agree with this decision. We could see a new stronger scout group rise from this or we could see a changing of the guard. If only it was this easy with our government.    

      I think it will be hard to get 12 people to agree on a verdict in this case. I think it will be a hung jury and the drama will start again as the state decides if it will retry the case or not.

  http://www.onmyhonor.net/whats-next/   Interesting. It appears a line has been drawn in the sand. Scouts and their parents will make a decision based on their beliefs free from public opinion of those not involved.  It’s a shame an honored origination like the BSA would allow themselves to possibly be taken down over gay rights. But it appears some are ready to stand up for their moral and religious beliefs.

 Make whatever arguments you want about Boy Scouts and the church, but the fact remains (according to them) most are sponsored by churches. Most churches will not give the gays the stamp of approval they demand. I suspect a new organization that is clear in their moral and religious beliefs will rise from this controversy.   I also see comments about gay scout leaders. It is my understanding that gay scout leaders are still banned. No matter which side of this you are on I don’t see how an origination that says you can be a gay scout, but can never be a scout leader will survive.    

 

I confused as to what the “Watch Captain” or “On Duty” has to do with anything? Does being a neighborhood watch member have some special privileges in Florida? Is being a “Watch Captain” something special? If Zimmerman was an off duty cop the first question would be “Did he identify himself as a Police Officer?” The second question would be “Did he have authority to act?” So… How did Zimmerman convey to Martin that he was someone special and Martin didn’t need to be afraid? And does a “Watch Captain” have authority? Is there such a thing as a “Watch captain” being on or off duty?

  Are we to believe that Zimmerman was so physically inferior to Martin that he couldn’t push Martin off him or defended himself against him; but that Zimmerman was able to physically stop Martin from gaining control of his weapon that he was supposedly going for and shoot Martin?

   It isn’t an unfounded allegation; it’s an undisputed fact. What did Martin do that gave Zimmerman the cause or authority to chase him when he was trying to get away from a guy following him and ultimately chasing him? Zimmerman was committing a crime when it turned into a pursuit. Disengaged? What authority or right did he have to “engage” in the first place? I guess a lot of this depends on who people identify with. Some seem to think convicting Zimmerman will somehow limit their ability to protect themselves. Nothing could be farther from the truth. Do any of you plan on jumping out of your truck and chasing a kid that you think is suspicious? I don’t. I identify with Martin. If I am walking down the street and some citizen thinks I look suspicious and he wants to check me out and starts approaching me in a threatening manner; I will display a weapon, that is my right to defend myself as an innocent citizen. If he has a gun a decides to draw; one of us is probably going to die. If I was the survivor and he was a dead neighborhood watch person I hate to think you would all be saying I had no right to protect myself in an unprovoked attack.

  That’s a point I made in the threads when this happened. “He could have ran away”. But that’s the whole issue of the stand your ground laws we all want to protect. He was committing no crime, he had every right to be there, and he had absolutely no requirement to run from a stranger with no legal authority to stop him. He did run and Zimmerman chased him. At some point he decided to stop running, stand his ground, and engage his attacker. Bad news for him; his attacker had a gun, he didn’t.

  Zimmerman lied in sworn testimony. His wife was arrested for perjury for her part. If the Judge allows all this BS about Martin in, he will also have to allow the past bad acts of Zimmerman in. His lying under oath, domestic violence, attacking a cop; he’s toast as far as credibility. OJ walked because three cops took the stand and lied. The jury decided to disregard their testimony and they were not left with enough for a conviction. If they throw out all statements made by Zimmerman; they will be left with a dead kid that did nothing wrong. I don't belive anything Zimmerman says.

   So he had stopped the attack and was now trying to stop Zimmerman from shooting him?

  I would guess that every department has their own policy’s on how they arrest and charge people. For most crimes I charged whatever I wanted and it had to be approved by Command. Then it went to the States Attorney for formal charges. Homicide was an exception. In a homicide case we did not define charges until we talked to the States Attorney; we had one on call 24 hours a day. Our States Attorney’s Office charged what they saw fit. They also had their own investigators that were not part of the Police Department. That’s only my experience; I don’t know how it works in that department in Florida.

   Some of us are questioning what Zimmerman did. I can’t speak for the others but I am white. From reading my posts or anyone else’s here do you think we are making this a race issue? The community is up in arms because they saw an injustice unfolding. You want to dismiss that as the community being racist?

   Where was Zimmerman’s gun prior to the confrontation, was he open carrying, was it in his hand? Did Martin see it? You say Zimmerman says he shot martin while Martin was pounding his head in the ground. You want us to believe that Martin was trying to get control of Zimmerman’s gun, but then quit trying and gave Zimmerman free access to his gun while Martin grabbed his head and started banging it into the ground? That doesn’t make sense. Did Martin stop, try to withdrawal from the fight and Zimmerman shot him? These are things that need to be addressed in court.

I just can’t dismiss this as a race issue. If I was a member of the black community and I had to yell racism to bring attention to this and get justice; so be it. I’m not convinced race was a determining factor in Zimmerman picking Martin out, but I’m not sure it wasn’t. If I was the lawyers on either side I would be going through all the calls he made to Police and find out. I think the bigger issue was Zimmerman wanting to be cop. He wanted to be a cop; that is no secret. He had a couple of obstacles in his way. His girlfriend had accused him of domestic violence and he had been arrested for assaulting a Police Officer during an altercation in a bar. No department was going to hire him. It is made very clear to Neighborhood watch people they do not engage. I’m unfamiliar with Florida law. What “right” did he have as a neighborhood watch captain; do they have some kind of authority? Police Officers and licensed Security Guards have the training and ability to escalate the level of force used. He did not have that training or ability; he went right to deadly force. If he was “patrolling” the neighborhood why did he not have mace, a Taser, a baton or the ability to call backup? He didn’t have any more right than any other citizen to do that, but when you try to approach someone that has committed no crime but is just suspicious to you, and they run in fear; you stop. Trying to make Martin out to be a thug because he had smoked pot and talked about guns in laughable when he has no criminal record and your client has two documented acts of violence, carried a gun, and has now shot a kid to death.

  It shouldn’t have anything to do with it unless it was a reason Zimmerman picked out Martin. I would want that answered if I was a juror, and I would want to hear it from Zimmerman. Accusing someone of racism isn’t bad if that is what happened.     This isn’t a political issue unless you think a local DA should have unlimited discretion in a murder investigation when the Police have ask for an arrest warrant. And he better listen to the community when they tell him an injustice is taking place. Not sending this case to trial would have been an injustice no matter what race the victim was.