TGO David

For you I'll do it for the low low in-network price of zero dollas. You want to ban this jackass? I'll issue the refund now.

I've had a long week at work, I'm two fingers into a three finger pour of bourbon, and have zero ####s left to give about precious little princesses who want to cop an attitude with me or the moderators about the work we do to keep this place from turning into a complete dumpster fire. Wrong week to #### with me.

I'll let @The Big Guy tell you who it is.

Just as the subject reads. I got a sniveling PM from a guy because he thinks the announcement I made about the Fringe Forums being a work in progress shouldn't apply to him. He doesn't want to wait to throw in his two cents while everyone else is patiently letting me get my work done. Now, granted, our rules plainly state: But I'll gladly kick him off the forum if a few members want to spare a few bucks to send a message. Hell, I may do it anyway and cover it out of my own pocket just because I am sick to death of whiney-assed people who think they are special little creations that everyone else should treat differently. Let me know.

*** I am not a lawyer, nor do I play one on TV. This is not legal advice. Seek reputable legal counsel. *** I think it is important to ask yourself why the ATF would be willing to offer you the ability to register your pistol under the NFA as a Short Barrel Rifle (SBR), at no cost to you, when they normally charge registrants $200 per item. On the surface one can assume that they are doing this to throw gun owners a bone since pistol braces have been legal to own and use forever, up until whatever they have in mind for changes to current firearms law. One can assume good intentions and assume that the ATF feels slightly guilty about the fact that they have enabled... nay, encouraged consumers to buy pistol braces either to address their own physical limitations or for other reasons. I tend not to assume the good intentions of bureaucrats, bureaucracies or governments simply because they have never proven themselves to be trustworthy, benevolent, or good stewards of the money and power imbued to them. I mean... there is literally history behind this skepticism. A lot of history, documented in countless books and tomes, showing how the government can, will, and has destroyed, maimed, deprived, withheld from, and killed the citizens who put said-government in power. So let's assume that something else is motivating this apparent act of generosity. What are some possible negatives to registering your pistol as a Short Barrel Rifle under the NFA? 1. Your rifle becomes registered. You may say, "Well they already know that I've bought this gun, or other guns, anyway - so I am already on their list." But, are you? The ATF is not supposed to have copies of the Form 4473 that you filled out at the gun shop unless that gun shop has gone out of business and, per law, surrendered their 4473s to the ATF to be stored in a warehouse. But how much of that do you really trust? Consider as well that the government has proven repeatedly that it can back-track a firearm to the original individual who purchased it, but working forward from the manufacturer who recorded the serial number, to the distributor who wholesaled it, to the shop they sold it to, to the person who bought it from the shop. So, yes, a paper trail exists and it isn't hard for the government to use it. Also, bear in mind that this only covers the first purchaser of a firearm. Which brings me to my second point. 2. It now becomes illegal to transfer your rifle to anyone else in a private sale unless they buy a Tax Stamp ($200) and pass a background check, get fingerprinted or file as a trust, corporation or other legal entity, wait a year or so, and then transfer the firearm to themselves legally. The secondary market appeals to people who value their privacy and their inherent, creator-given right to life and and a means to defend it. Secondary sales aren't the domain of criminals. Goodbye, legal private party sales of your private property without going through an FFL and all of the other rigmarole. It also becomes illegal for anyone other than yourself to be in possession of the firearm without you present, unless the firearm is owned by a Trust (or corporation or other legal entity) of which they are a trustee or officer. For NFA items registered solely to an individual, this gets tricky if you... say... are married and leave the NFA item behind while you travel for work, or commute to work, or go get groceries, or end up in the hospital, etc. and your spouse, children or other family have what the ATF would consider to be reasonably easy access to that item in your absence. If they know the combination of the gun safe, or have access to the combination or key, or wherever you've stashed it... they could be guilty of a crime also and be sentenced to prison for it. Along with you. 3, It now becomes subject to more stringent local laws. Some states don't allow you to possess an NFA item within their confines. You can't travel to or through some states, easily, with an NFA item. This alone is one reason why braces on AR pistols have become popular. People like being able to travel without having to show ze papers. 4. It becomes difficult to enable inheritance of your pistol if they are registered as an NFA item. Trusts make this slightly easier, but many have term limits, or limits on the number of times trustees can be added, or who can add trustees, etc. Without being on a trust, your spouse, partner, children, other family have to apply for new tax stamps and pass background checks for anything that you leave to them and buy the $200 tax stamp. Some states and some trusts are designed to only allow them to endure for a certain number of years. At the end of their term, whoever the trustees are have to... you guessed it... pass background checks, buy tax stamps, etc. regardless of whether the NFA items go to them or if they are going back into a NEW trust. It's the most ridiculous form of taxation imaginable. 5, Registration facilitates confiscation. End of story. If they can track it to you, they can make you forfeit it or tell them who you sold/transferred it to and then go make them forfeit it. Forfeiture includes destruction, for the sake of brevity. Regardless, they don't call them paper trails for nothing. I am sure I am forgetting some other negatives. I'll add them as I think of them or as others point them out.

Registration facilitates confiscation. Remember that.

@Chucktshoes I was coming to the forum to post this and saw that you had replied with it to another thread. I've split it into its own thread to increase awareness.

Here are some good podcast episodes that my friends over at Guardian News Podcast did with Luis Chirino at Holosun. They're worth listening to, especially on the subjects of the Glock MOS and plate systems. https://www.stitcher.com/show/guardian-news-podcast/episode/episode-20-78213213 https://www.stitcher.com/show/guardian-news-podcast/episode/episode-21-78403788

As long as the optic comes off on the return cycle of the firing sequence, you have two projectiles going toward your target.

You know, you have inadvertently made a connection between 9/11, the Global War On Terror and COVID that I am willing to discuss. Your call to the 9/11 Commission and their observation that the terror attacks on the US that day were retaliation for our involvement in the Middle East hints at the notion that we shouldn't have been over there in the first place. The problem with that line of thinking is that it evokes the concept of appeasement and the flawed logic that assumes that we would be left alone if we left others alone... that doing nothing would be preferable to what we've done. Unfortunately it doesn't work like that, regardless of whether you are discussing Islamic terrorism or the COVID-19 virus. Doing nothing, in either case, is actually a decision for inaction and hoping that the threat goes away - which is still an action of doing something. It's a completely useless something but it's a decision, a direction, and an [in]action nonetheless. Our response to the threat of jihad waged against Western civilization may not have been perfect, but it was a response that worked very well when the public and our elected government still had the courage and resolve to wage a fight. It's hard for the bully to throw punches when he's busy defending himself. For a long while we kept the bully busy. When we stopped doing that because we lost the resolve, he started hitting back. Thankfully, after 9/11 we got our resolve back again. For a while. Our current response to COVID is to fight it through the application of some basic preventative measures and of some pretty advanced medical science. We aren't just putting our heads in the sand and hoping that the virus goes away. You seem to like quoting quotable people and written works, so this will be right up your alley: "The only thing necessary for evil to triumph in the world is that good men do nothing. (Edmund Burke)" Don't be the guy that advocates for doing nothing and hoping the bad thing goes away. It doesn't. Ever. Not without a fight.

Careful. You've got a person in this thread who was there on 9/11 and spent weeks afterward digging through the rubble as part of recovery efforts. You don't want to go down that road here.

See this thread.

Oh, I didn't take it that way at all.

Eh... I'll make a concession here. The MOS system works fine if you use the correct length screws. It works even better if you get an improved mounting plate from C&H Precision Weapon Systems. https://chpws.com/

I'll buy the crap out of a 10mm single stack Glock.

FIRST... See this news story: https://sg.news.yahoo.com/gmail-pretty-broken-now-one-224052039.html GMAIL is having massive problems that is causing email to bounce for millions of people right now. I have disabled the feature that I believe is causing accounts to be thrown into an "invalid" state here on TGO as a result of it. I am working through the process of re-validating accounts for people right now. Please give me a little time to get accounts fixed. The Invision Power forum software company is aware of this but there is little they can do to fix it since it's a problem with Google / GMail.

All you ever wanted to know about Cloudflare. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloudflare It's very common. Those sites may have either recently experienced DDoS attacks or are anticipating them due to the election / holiday shopping, and either started using CF or have ramped up the level of aggressiveness of CF's visitor checking.

Buy a slide that is already milled and use it on your gun. There are plenty of options out there now. Brownells, Zev, Grey Ghost, you name it. Lots of options. You can probably find an OEM Glock MOS slide even.

There are certain email hosts that have historically just not worked for us. Yahoo and a few others. GMail has almost always worked.

I need to order some LPK parts from them.

I did an opinion piece on this last year. It sucks BAD that it feels like I was clairvoyant in respect to this, but the Cliffs Notes go like this: Constrict the supply of ammunition through EPA regulations and other "end runs" that make it difficult or impossible to feed the gun. Declare "undesirable" categories of weapons as NFA devices and force people to apply for an NFA stamp and register them. (Step 1) Declare that these NFA items are non-transferrable beyond the current owner, whether that be an individual or a trust. (Step 2) Within two generations, tops, all of the undesirable guns will either be forfeited or illegal contraband... that you can't feed or allow to be seen in public. We are currently in the first bullet point. The second bullet point is coming.

Here's more happy news for you all: BATFE is now visiting consumers who purchased the Polymer 80 "Buy, Build, Shoot" kits and demanding forfeiture and threatening that they will return with a warrant and raid the consumer's home. https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2020/12/11/polymer80-kits/ This #### is 100% unacceptable. BATFE is clearly getting ballsy now that they think a new captain will be at the wheel of the ship in a few weeks. Buckle up, folks. It's going to be ugly if Harris and her rickety old Trojan Horse get into office.

Just so you have a north star for what I am about to say, if you take the Constitution and Bill of Rights at face value, all gun laws are infringements upon your rights. So let's build from there. It is 100% legal to build a firearm from either scratch or from an 80% complete component which would otherwise be serialized for your own use, not for resale, and not serialize it. What bootlicking logic are you abiding by that would cause you to serialize a thing that you legally built for yourself when serializing it isn't required? There are many other firearms that you can build from an 80% kit. Muskets, cap and ball pistols, AR pattern rifles, and a multitude of modern striker fired 80% polymer pistols based upon the Glock Gen 3 design. Polymer 80 was the first to bring the latter to market and it has inspired a cottage industry. Further, the BATFE currently - apparently - doesn't even have a problem with that, per se, since their grievance with P80 seems to be with a particular package and not with the 80% receiver itself. Beyond that, anyone with basic tools can build a gun. It may not be sexy and may not be polymer, but it's easily done and probably far more often than you or I will ever have any way to ascertain the frequency of. Because it's legal and private and legal to be private and no one has to tell a soul about it, account for it, serialize it, register it, or report it. Those are the true "ghost guns" because there is no paper trail. There are no invoices, no shipping receipts, no bills of lading. They. Don't. Exist. And that is ####ing awesome. I really wonder about people like you who seem to have a problem with firearms ownership if it's not tracked or restricted. Do you have similar complaints about home-brewing of beer? It feels like fair-weather support of the Second Amendment to me, but I guess maybe I am just more tired of infringement than you are. Since you are this opposed to 80% firearms, I presume we won't see any for sale at premium prices a few weeks from now when supply is short and demand is high.

I don't disagree, but why not use something like privacy.com to set up single-use or vendor-specific cards that you populate with funds as needed?