TGO David

One minor thing worth mentioning: We bought one of these for my wife a few months back and have noticed that it shoots about 2" lower than point of aim. I intend to send it back to S&W to have them figure out what's wrong with it, but it is a very real problem and does it 100% of the time. My other M&Ps don't have this issue so I don't know if it's just another example of an odd M&P slipping through the cracks, or a problem with the fiber optic front / Warren Tactical rear sight combo or something else entirely.

@OngoingFreedom -- Your cute thread nearly got you banned. I took the time to read it a little closer to see what you were saying before I pulled the trigger, but obviously not everyone else did. If your fellow gun-owners misread it, what do you think a reporter would do? My suggestion to you is to save the funny stuff for threads of less significance in the future.

Yeah fine but did you search the keyword I gave? I have posted a pretty good review of that holster elsewhere and it might help you.

Ever tried an AHolster?

I don't know the answer to that, but I will ask. Fundamentally I'd say that anything that lets you shoot and hit the target is going to be OK for punching paper and if it removes an obstacle standing between you and training, why not. BUT, I could also foresee the argument being made that you should train as you fight, and unless you plan on fighting with a .22LR conversion in your AR15... Finally I will also say that many of the After Action Reports given by students who have gone through these or similar classes have said that the rate of fire and round counts characteristic of this type of training will make faulty gear fail. I read plenty of stories about people having difficulty with their .22LR conversion kits just punching paper at the range on lazy weekend afternoons. I question whether a conversion kit like this would really function up to par while subjected to the sort of abuse you and your gun are going to see in a Dynamic Carbine class.

Front Sight's training has never really been an issue for me. The reports I've read from students all seem to indicate favorable experiences. The problem that I have stems from their business practices and the significant cloud of bad-things that seems to surround their founder / chief executive. Those issues keep me from considering them as a viable option for training.

Try before you buy. Find a range that rents various handguns in various calibers and try them. See what fits best for you. Your questions are, at no fault of your own, rife with things that indicate that your knowledge of handguns and terminal ballistics are fairly limited. Again, by no fault of your own. We all start somewhere. The .380 has regained popularity again lately for reasons that honestly escape me. It is on the weak end of the spectrum and at one point was relegated strictly to the domain of backup guns. Clever marketing has created a paradigm shift in the gun-buying public and more people are going to it as their primary weapon of choice. I have no idea why. The ballistics characteristics of the .380 ACP just aren't what I would want in a primary handgun. That being said, there is no such thing as "stopping power" so if we set that aside and consider that what makes a handgun cartridge potent are it's abilities to expand and to penetrate, we should reasonably agree that you want a handgun cartridge that is capable of good performance in both areas. The .380 just can't. Hence, most savvy shooters carry .380 ACP in hardball, FMJ round nose so that they can get maximum penetration out of the round rather than have it expand and lose velocity extremely fast as soon as it hits clothing, flesh, muscle, bone. I'd be thinking more in terms of 9mm, .38spl, .357 Mag, .40SW, or .45ACP for my primary carry weapon. There really is little difference between the terminal ballistics of any of these in "social applications" so just pick the one that works best for you. Just my 2-cents.

http://www.tngunowners.com/forums/search.php Keywords "AHolster"

Wait... wasn't there a thread on here just yesterday or the day before where someone was complaining that a journalist at the Nashville Scene had referred to gun owners as "assclowns" ? I suppose it's ok for us to refer to people that we don't agree with as asshats, however. I'd suggest taking the high road. I wish I knew someone who had actually read TGO's Code of Conduct and knew that promoting illegal activities isn't tolerated here. Further, what you are in essence advocating, beyond the criminal act of hacking a server and defacing a web site, is in essence the practice of stifling the web master's right to Free Speech. How can we expect anyone to realistically appreciate our Right To Bear Arms if our members think it is OK to squash other people's rights? And need I remind anyone here how much it F-ING SUCKED when TGO's own web server was under attack just a few months ago? That cost me a lot of time and money to resolve, and we were forced offline quite a bit because of it. THINK BEFORE YOU POST.

There was a poll to begin with but I removed it.

Hex, the beauty of the American system is such that if you don't like the laws of a particular State you can either vote to affect change or you can move to a state with laws more to your liking. So when you hit the point that you've had more than you can take of the nonsense here in Tennessee, which I do agree is completely nonsensical, the lawful recourse would be to pack up and move to another state. Or you can stick it out here and fight the good fight with the rest of us, but do so legally.

Chris Costa recommended that if we do that, we do Dynamic Carbine first as it will address several fundamental things that will help in Dynamic Handgun. So yes, that discussion has already taken place. If we do, we'd likely do Handgun later in 2010 so that people have time to replenish their wallets and ammo supply.

Wow, that's crazy. Just to think, you could have picked up any number of pre-built AR's of equal or better quality since then. Del-Ton really needs to get on the ball.

An injunction would postpone the law going into effect. If that happens, you would be breaking the law if you carry into a place that serves alcohol and is not otherwise posted. So this thread really should be: Hey, how many of you are going to break the law on July 14th? Maybe start a new poll with that title and let me know so that I can call the media and direct them to a thread where supposedly responsible, upright citizens are indicating that they intend to do something unlawful. Seriously, think before you post a thread.

Welcome, Dennis. I recently took up reloading myself. It really adds another dimension to our hobby doesn't it?

The plan right now is that you only pay if you eat. The proceeds from that go to the guy supplying and cooking the food.

That's my ring tone.

I'm going to go easy on you guys who voted NO and change the poll. All of us men here are manly men (except for StrickJ) so I know it's not a lack of testosterone keeping you away from the class. Ammo costs alone will be pretty steep.

If any of our vendors want to do that, I would certainly welcome it and add that information to the first post in this thread. Perhaps several vendors would even be willing since students might end up coming from various parts of the state. Vendors, if you're interested hit me up with the info. Thanks!

Folks, please join me in welcoming Jasongar8 as moderator in the Class III (NFA) Firearms and Accessories forum. Jason has quite a bit of experience in this area. Anyone who attended the June 2009 Middle TN Meet & Shoot will remember Jason as one of the folks who brought the Browning M2 .50cal and the Browning .30cal as well as a few different NFA toys.

Exactly. It never ceases to amaze me that some people are always looking for the dark lining to a silver cloud.

You know, I'd have already done that if it were that simple. We are still waiting on final word from several key players. Hang tight.

First post in this thread updated to reflect event date and time: Saturday, July 18th. 11am - 2pm.

Yeah, it's a lot of brass. Easily $800 worth if you shoot XM193 and don't buy it in bulk. Magpul Dynamics has no shortage of people wanting to take their classes and the AAR's that I have read elsewhere are nothing but glowing. I've yet to read an AAR from someone who felt like they didn't get their money's worth out of their class. As far as I know, you're welcome to run whatever gear you use in the field. If there are specific items that you're concerned about, let me know and I'll ask Chris Costa when I speak with him next. I'm really hoping for the 3-Day class, myself. I realize it adds even more overhead in terms of ammo, but Chris says that with a 3-Day class, by the time Day 3 rolls around you're getting to do some pretty advanced stuff.

They say the following is their guideline: 2-Day Course: 1500rds carbine, 200rds handgun 3-Day Course: 2000rds carbine, 300rds handgun I understand that these numbers are enough to make some people wince. It's also enough to make others say "To hell with that" and not even try to attend. I tend to look at this as a vetting process, even for myself. If I am serious about the class and serious about wanting to learn, I'm going to make the investment. Some folks will want to attend but simply won't be able to because of the cost associated. I understand that and can empathize. I've been there. This will easily be the most expensive class that I personally have attended... but I know it will be worth the investment if I am able to put out for it.