TGO David

5 months!!! Cripes. That doesn't give me a warm fuzzy feeling.

It's a bit of homage to a gaff that an HK annual came out with a few years ago. Whomever did their marketing photo set up a mag with a round in backwards accidentally. It became rather infamous in the HK circle, so... it's the only way to properly photograph an HK handgun now. Edited to add, here is the photo:

I've been trying to find a polymer frame .45ACP that I liked enough to consider carrying. I had an affair with a Glock 21 SF but just couldn't really get used to it for some reason. I tried to convince my wife that maybe an M&P 45 would be fun, but she said we had enough M&P automatics in the house as is. Today I had a visit with my friend Daniel up at Guns & Leather in Greenbrier and he set me up with this... I ordered a leather inside the waistband holster from TT Gunleather over the weekend, knowing good and well that this was going to end up following me home, but the wait on them is somewhere around 12-14 weeks. I'll probably pick up a kydex OWB holster from Comp-Tac in the meantime just so that I will have the option of carrying it sooner than the end of the year. I really wish there wasn't such a long delay on custom leather, but even at 3 months it is a faster alternative than Milt Sparks. Sooner or later some traditional tritium sights will make their way onto it as well. I'll live with the kooky glow-in-the-dark sights at least until I have a holster for the gun.

If you have not already installed your detents and take-down pins, do yourself a favor and get an AR15 detent installation tool. It makes life a lot easier. There are tricks to doing it without one, but it's not worth the hassle when the tool itself is only $4.

Fast is fine, but accuracy is final. --Larry Vickers You can't miss fast enough. --Unknown Every bullet you fire has a lawyer attached to it. --Unknown Speed comes as a natural progression of accuracy. Combat accuracy is a loose term defining the act of putting all of your bullets into the target at the maximum effective range of a defensive situation. Pulling the trigger fast does no good if you're sending your shots into the scenery around your target. Continue working on the basics of sight alignment and trigger control. A competent shooter should be able to group their shots into a space the size of a 3x5 note card at 7yds without problem. Then work back to 15yds and push yourself to achieve the same goal. Once you can do that with slow, deliberate shots, go back to 7yds and start pushing yourself to accelerate your follow-up shots. There is no sense in hosing your target with rounds. 2-3 shot strings are sufficient. Keep working at it and keep pushing yourself to the point just past the envelope of where you are no longer accurate, then dial it back a little. This is the most effective way of training to improve both accuracy and speed. Good luck.

Google maps, dude. It's about a 1hr - 1hr 15min drive from Murfreesboro depending on traffic and your driving style.

Jack Daniel's black label and Diet Coke over ice.

Sunday.... carried the Kimber Warrior in a Milt Sparks VM2, spare mag weak side in Comp-Tac single mag pouch.

That is a sweet firearm! I will have to dig around and see if I have any of my old P220 holsters or other gear that you might be able to make use of. As much as I love the P220, I have gotten to the point where I feel as if I'm going to carry a single stack .45ACP, I might as well carry a 1911. The 220 is certainly an evolution of that concept and I think you're going to love it. Oh, and I also have a SIG-specific MGW sight installation tool if you ever decide to swap sights for some reason. Just hit me up.

Oh, one last thing... That is probably the most ridiculous political observation that I've ever read on TGO. Actually, the unfettered arrogance of the typical American consumer thinking that they are God's gift to every industry that sells a good or service is probably more at fault for the erosion of capitalism than anything. The American consumer has become so accustomed to always being "right" and demanding of the lowest prices, to hell with the consequences, that many American businesses could no longer compete with the off-shore sweat shops that were willing to do whatever it took to deliver. Think... Wal-mart. Think... Apple's iPod factory labor-camps in China. We Americans tend to be cheap bastards with an absurd sense of entitlement, and it has caused tremendous damage to our economy as a result.

I must have struck a nerve. Are you that guy at gun shops or something? Let's assume that you are in the top 10% of consumers who know exactly what they need and do not want or require the assistance of a salesperson who has taken the time to educate themselves on the wide range of options and subtleties of whatever product category it is you're shopping for. Awesome! Bud's Gun Shop and Gun Broker exist specifically for people like you who have done all of their homework and aren't open to the suggestions of an unbiased sales person who isn't paid on commission and isn't trying to push an agenda. Granted, it may be rare to find sales people of that nature in the whole of retail, but it's not that rare in the gun world. Hell, the price margin is too narrow to begin with so it's not like any sane person would work on commission in gun sales. I submit that you might reconsider what strikes me as being a fairly condescending attitude toward gun store clerks. There are good stores out there and there are sales consultants in those stores who aren't just fed on Guns & Ammo or American Handgunner and who actually do know what they are talking about. You might look at them and think, "I'm smarter than this guy because I've got a real job. I'm not going to listen to a damn thing he says because *I* know what *I* want." Maybe you should lighten up a little, be slightly more open minded, and realize that this mere salesperson isn't necessarily an ignorant ass trying to push whatever gun is hot and happening at the moment, but that he's someone who is around hundreds of different firearms every day and has probably picked up a smart idea or two along the way that you could benefit from. Really it's no skin off of my teeth either way. I don't work at or own a gun shop. I just tend to be a more open minded about the experience of people in sales and apparently put a little more value in what they are saying even if I temper it with what I've learned from doing my own research before hand.

Very interesting. Thanks for sharing that.

These douchebags have a lot of firearms related forums and sites blocked on their Sonicwall WiFi appliance. In fact, I'm amazed that I am able to use their network to access TGO. They don't post on the door but they don't want you looking at gun sites either. Maybe I'll clean my gun here at the table before we leave.

Pretty much. Here's the deal, Skippy. I don't mind answering legitimate questions and enjoy sharing the things that I've learned along the way. You've asked for some clarification in that reply and I'm happy to provide it. The problem is you've kind of made yourself a Sh-t Magnet with some of the things you've said in a few other threads. I chalk it up to you being young and thinking you know a lot more about life than you really do. I was there once and probably annoyed some folks too. If you want to be accepted here, I'd suggest a lower-profile for a while until you figure out what the status quo is around here. 20lpi refers to the 20 lines per inch checkering on the backstrap of the main spring housing. On my Kimber, the main spring housing (MSH) is an aftermarket piece made by MARS Armament that also incorporates an enlarged magazine well that helps funnel the mag into the frame a little quicker under stress. The lanyard loop is built into the MSH and is not visible in any of the pictures that I posted. Since you pointed that out, I realized that I should have taken a picture of that as it's actually kind of a cool piece. I'll try to do that later today and add a picture. And finally, the sights are a custom piece made by Hilton Yam over at 10-8 Performance. He is a professional SWAT dude down in Florida and a very well respected authority on building utilitarian "fighting" 1911s. The sights sit higher to clear a suppressor if you wanted to add one, and the rear sight is notched heavily to provide a solid hook for racking the slide one-handed using a table, your belt, holster, rock, something.

As a business owner, I would love to find the person who originally started advocating that nonsense and then punch them in the neck. That is perhaps one of the biggest lies in retail that for some reason has become an accepted truth just because everyone has heard it at some point. The customer is not always right, period. Customers frequently think that they are right about what they want until a sales consultant shows them a better option, more perfectly suited to their situation or needs. A smart customer realizes this and allows a sales consultant the chance to earn their trust and business. If you base "rightness" on the power of a customer to potentially give a business their money, you completely discount the fact that sometimes customers are truly clueless about what is best. Any moron can sell you exactly what you ask for as long as they are willing to disengage their sense of ethics and don't mind facilitating your mistakes. An ethical, honest businessman will take the risk of losing the sale just to make sure that they aren't complicit in you choosing poorly. Think about that some.

First let me get this out of the way: Joe is a friend and automatically anything I say about him is going to be translated by someone as me just taking up for him. The truth is that I have no problem telling my friends that they're being a dick, when they're being a dick. So no free rides here. That said... I have personally witnessed Joe bending over backwards to make deals happen for customers, sometimes at a loss to himself. Scratch that, frequently it has been at a margin where it had to be a loss for him on that particular sale. Why he does that is pretty clear: He wants to earn people's business as repeat customers. Joe's shop wouldn't be growing exponentially every year if he treated people like you have described. In fact what worries me is that the tone of what you wrote almost suggests that you intend to start spreading the word that Joe @ Hero Gear is a jerk and won't wheel and deal with people on prices. If you've never set foot in his store and dealt with him, please don't start a rumor like that based off of your impressions in this thread. Not about Joe, not about anyone. We are extremely fortunate to have top notch stores represented here as Authorized Vendors and none of them, to my knowledge, have ever treated people the way that you more or less described. In fact, there has only been one shop represented on TGO that had a questionable attitude toward prospective customers and that shop lost their Vendor status as a result. Like Joe said, there are two ways to find out what the business practices are of any of our vendors: Ask around or shop there. TGO often serves as a place where people can come and blow off some steam and express frustrations about certain industry aspects in the company of friends. That privilege extends even to our Vendors. I ask that you respect that freedom by reading the things said here in context of their intended spirit rather than extrapolating incorrect ideas from them and then using those assumptions to label people. Thanks.

Nothing at all. Shima asked for Jason's help in this forum as his own employer has been working him like a rented mule lately. Massive overtime. Jason is a true enthusiast and is always buying, selling and trading for cool new toys. I'm glad he accepted the offer and I'm sure Shima is as well.

Hang on a minute. You seem to be the one getting defensive here. Joe was replying in a "Devil's Advocate" sort of fashion and was using your comments as the opposing side in the same spirit. He wasn't accusing you of anything from what I read.

For purely target shooting purposes I see no problem with it. Many of us who practice shooting ambidextrously for "injured shooter drills" would be hampered with that sort of grip design.

Bowling tonight with the Smith & Wesson M&P 340 in an A-Holster pocket rig. We're thinking about going back later when they do unlimited bowling after midnight. If we do, the Glock 19 is going with me inside it's MTAC. (The freaks come out at that place after 1am when the clubs all start closing down)

Glad to hear that you guys had a good time! How many showed up today?

I can't seem to find your picture thread.

Gouging aside, are gun dealers just not supposed to make money anymore or what? I'm glad I don't own a gun shop. I'd probably last about as long as it took me to run out of rent money, because I'd constantly being telling some cheap jerk where he could go get a gun for free: by enlisting.

I hate haggling and have always priced anything I've sold below retail and at a price point where I'm making what I need to get out of it while the buyer was assured of getting a sweet deal in the process. It's just easier to use the "CarMax Mentality" when I sell guns. Here's the price, it's not only reasonable but also a great deal, no haggling required and we all go home happy. Why some folks refuse to do it that way is anyone's guess. I can't help but wonder, however, if the people who expect top dollar for their used gear are the same ones who nickle and dime gun shops to death, and expect the shop owner to literally pay them to take their guns.

Today: M&P 40 in MTAC and SOG Xray Vision. It may change later... I'm getting the itch to tote the Kimber around some more.