GlockSpock

  Too good to be true, probably is. But, I was open to the possibility that maybe they were hoping to move 15 stock getting room for 16 stock and were discounting them an extra $4,000 or so. This is technically true, but the $4,000 just takes the place of the existing $3,500 in rebates. I might have technically saved $500 today, but I doubt they would have came to a "better deal" today than they would have anyway last week.      Well, I have always in a sense immortalized Jeep. I guess for multiple reasons. The old inline 6's seemed to be great, and they just were made better. That being said, going bankrupt, taking bailout money, and then being bought out by Fiat hasn't done the Jeep name any favors. This experience (reading about people's Cherokee's needing a new transmission 12 hours after purchase, this happened to a co-worker's daughter just a week or so ago) may be enough to convince me to avoid Jeep at least for the foreseeable future.   Maybe the Explorer, decently ok fan of Ford myself. My Fusion (2012) has about 52,000 miles on it and hasn't shown the first problem. Just sort of tired of the car idea and like the idea of getting back into an SUV. The 4 Runners are nice but most of what I have seen the new ones to be are that they are too "fancy". That being said, I'll look into them further as I have read them to be one of the best reliable SUV's.   Yep, I honestly cannot say I have experienced yet a single "auto person" that I have felt that I could trust. I guess the exception to that would probably be the mechanic we've been using a bit, but mostly just to buy farm fresh eggs sometimes because they own a farm:) They (husband and wife owned business) seem to be great. Car salesman, especially the managers, all seem to crawl around like snakes when they think nobody is looking. Sorry if that insults a car salesman here, but my experience has been that everyone of them has tried to slip something by me that they didn't think I would notice.   I do sort of want to go back just to know what a base model gets me. Some of the extras are nice, but I consider myself decently frugal on "upgrades" and things like navigation, voice control, etc are all just more crap a lot of the time. That being said, I honestly do value keyless entry/ignition and remote start, but those serve actual purposes in my mind even if that purpose is fulfilling a sense of laziness. Pretty set on not buying anything this weekend. If I do decide to buy something in particular, thinking about maybe talking to the credit union, getting "approved" for $30,000 but probably plan on spending less. After I find something I like, try and sell my Fusion private party to someone on here or the like and then buying outright at the dealership, financing the difference at the CU. So I'll probably go check it out for 15, say thanks for time but tell them it is Friday night and I have a really beautiful Wife to go home to and I'm not wasting anymore time there.   I bet if I do that they call me Saturday saying they can come down another $500 or $1000 on that Trailhawk (or of course padding the trade in the equivalent).   I basically view buying a car like a game. You cannot really win, but you can get further than others. If you don't buy at all it is like getting your fifty cents back so that you can try again. I'm not afraid of insulting them, because they don't care once bit at all ever to insult the hell out of you.   All things I heard tonight:   "Guess that is just too much Jeep for you huh?"                     Me: Oh yeah, I really don't think I could handle that much.   "For that deal to happen, it would take magic"                     Me,later: Well, it would take magic for us to make a deal tonight.   "How is that 4x4 working on your Ford Fusion"                      Me: Oh, it works great, I get 40 on the highway!   I don't see people's hangup about lowballing them. My supervisor told me that I'd be foolish to offer as low as trade + $15,000 and said they might laugh at me. I told him that if they laughed at me to my face I'd tell them that isn't a really good way to sell a car and walk away. I sure as hell told them I was around the $15,000 + trade range, knowing that they closest they might theoretically come best case scenario would be $20,000 + trade. Seeing as how they will take you for every penny possible I don't care to do that. 

Hahaha. Really so relieved to be truthful. Spent 1.5 hours at dealership earlier. Turns out that the "deal" offer of $14,000 trade in ($4,000 extra) means that they work from the sticker price without rebates. Too good to be true, probably is. http://www.crownchryslerdodgejeep.com/new/Jeep/2015-Jeep-Cherokee-d1c0f4370a0a00e07c09a670f99441d6.htm That is the exact vehicle. I was thinking about $32,000-$14,000 = $18,000 range. Now, there initial offer was trade + $27,000 OTD. Told them that we were so far off that I didn't want to waste their time. Told them I was in the trade + $15,000 range. I was told that would take "magic". Wasted 1.5 hours of their time (or is that them wasting 1.5 hours of mine?). They eventually came down to $25,000 + trade OTD. Honestly glad, although it is a GREAT looking vehicle inside and out, the transmission reports had me questioning everything. Relived because that means the "magical $4,000 extra" offer in the mail means absolutely nothing at all, and I am free of course to take as much time in the world researching makes, models, and dealerships. Will be taking recommendations and comparing all used and new SUV's. Don't even know I"ll do anything, but it would be fun to. Those guys thought they had me. Not saying that is a bad deal, but just more than I was willing to do. They convinced me to let them bring a base model Cherokee without all the extras but still has 4 x 4 in tomorrow. Told them if they did that I would test drive it. Would be a beat cheaper but I still don't think I'll even consider any offer unless they really hit me hard with a tempting good deal.

So, lets get this thread some replies. for a 4x4 SUV with great reliability and decent but not over the top amenities, what are my best options to compare to the Trailhawk?

Thanks. How many miles? Well, I am going to make sure that I get a decent price going to negotiate hard since I don't even need a new vehicle, just want. But I assume this time of year coupled with such a sale probably means trying to get rid of old stock. Maybe I'm wrong. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It is. But in the article it states that many many new model vehicles are susceptible to this. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

So, wow. http://www.carcomplaints.com/Jeep/Cherokee/2015/transmission/transmission_failure_check_engine_light_on.shtml http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/owners/SearchResults?prodType=V&searchType=PROD&targetCategory=A&searchCriteria.model=CHEROKEE&stats=1977408%2C2%2C1%2C146%2C9%2CCHEROKEE&makeStats=&jsonBaseURL=%2Fdownloads%2Ffolders%2F&searchCriteria.model_yr=2015&searchCriteria.make=JEEP&searchCriteria.prod_ids=1977408 Looks like it probably does suffer from transmission problems. Sucks because I do really want for it to be reliable. Just don't want something that will cause problems. Will continue to do more research. Looks like it is something they have been trying to fix, but "trying" seems to be the important part. I personally am not convinced nor knowledgable enough to have confidence in or knowledge to know mores about what the issue truly is in the design. Software programming or hardware failure? Both?

Well, I do love it but it depends on OTD price and reliability. Reliability is really a hard one seeing as how it is a newer "fresh" model. I have spent 30 minutes reading and it seems like half of the reviews are about people complaining about transmission problems at extremely low mileage. Love the look, love the ride and amenities, but not looking for something that has faulty design.

Well, I wouldn't honestly much consider a Dodge or Chrysler make, and I hope Jeep would hopefully be a step above their parent company but maybe not. Regarding taking it home, I new what he was doing but I also appreciated that it would give me an "extended" test drive. If I drove it longer and loved it that is just part of buying a car. If I drove it more and found something I disliked and wouldn't have discovered until after a purchase, then in that case that could be a big money saver. Thus, I decided to give it a try. Just so happened loved it so far.

Hahaha. Well I know what his answer would be of course. And typically I generally do follow his advice. But truthfully the monthly payment will be roughly the equivalent of what it was when buying the Fusion, which is now paid for (took 2.5 years to pay it off). Monthly payment wise, it is easily doable. Yes, the Fusion is paid for and no car payment beats any car payment. But I have missed having an SUV ever since I got rid of my old one. Yes the smart thing is to save cash and pay cash, but reasonably speaking saving $15,000 over the next three years would not get me a Jeep. In three years my Fusion will be worth less. At 2% or even lower interest, I feel depreciation would probably hit my trade in more than the interest of paying the financing. If I do it, I will owe roughly half of what it is worth, and will make extra payments in order to pay it off in probably 3 years or so. At any point I should owe at least $10,000 less than it is worth so if at any point I needed to "get out" I could comfortably with equity in my favor. It'd be like I had a 40% downpayment ready for it. This post, in my opinion, isn't so much as whether it is the most financially responsible thing to do, but rather how negotiable the dealer really is (how much wiggle room is really there for a new vehicle), whether the "new" Cherokee's are even any good/reliable, and whether there is something major to consider regarding the Jeep that perhaps I haven't thought about.

So, for the past three years I have been driving a 2012 Ford Fusion. I've wanted an SUV ever since I got rid of my Chevrolet Blazer. Accidentally (I mean literally, just drove by while working) spotted the "Trailhawk" Jeeps at the local dealership. Stock photo, pretty close but the one I'm eyeing has silver instead of the black wheels. Like the black wheels bester, but that package costs more and I'm already on the upperside of almost being too much. Received something from the local dealership about wanting to pay up to $4,000 more on trade in for my Ford Fusion. Figured probably marketing gimmick but why not try. Went and test drove Jeep today. Went back after work to attempt to buy, if we could reach an agreement. Was literally told to come back tomorrow because that is when corporate comes in tomorrow in order to "run" the "sale". Was also told to just drive the vehicle home tonight, which I did (which sadly was probably the smartest thing the salesman could have done to "hook" me. I have really spent some time in that thing, now I do feel attached. So, nutshells: $32,000 asking after rebates/incentives/discounts whatever "$14,000" trade in for my Ford Fusion (if the "offer" in the mail was remotely truthful. KBB trade-in is about $10,000. Really just means they are knocking off $4,000 from a new vehicle purchase in my opinion, which probably means they will be pretty inflexible in pricing. Supposedly also paying up to $1,500 in sales tax, which is about all I would have on a trade plus a few hundred. I REALLY want this vehicle, honestly. Never had a vehicle this nice, very surprised at how nice it is. Pretty much fully loaded except for some of the packages such as the heated seats package or the "sensor" package that tells you when you are about to hit something. Does have a backup cam, navigation, remote start, 8.4" touchscreen, 4x4, 3.2l V6, power up/down hatch, probably more but cannot think of it now. I have a number in my head that if they could do, I'll buy it no questions more. My trade + $15,000 financed through their or my lender, whichever better. I seriously doubt that is possible but that is my offer to them. Unless someone that works there happens to be a member here, I don't think I will hurt myself by admitting I would probably come up to maybe $17,000 out of pocket, but that's about it. So, what am I looking for specifically in this purchase? 1) SUV, yep 2) 4x4, yep (won't be really off-roading, but wanted for if I need it in snow, mud, trail or something unexpectedly. 3) reliability (I know people swore by the Cherokee inline 6's, sadly those are no more but I would expect or at least hope this vehicle would prove reliable 150k miles for at least 10 years if need be and maintained. Towing is a plus but I don't have anything to tow. If by chance asked to help someone on the side of the road tow hooks are nice to help them out of the side of the road, I guess. I want capability even though not necessarily expecting to use it much for 4x4/off road. So, for anyone that has recently purchased a Jeep or Chrysler, especially from Crown in Cleveland or Chattanooga, how did you do? They have what they call "transparent" pricing in which they claim to "have the best deal available no hassle". Well, that is a $32k vehicle. Personally I feel there is some haggle. I know some people buying for example Ford trucks claim to get down $10k off the sticker price. How much honestly do you think I should "stick to" if they did actually honor their "trade offer" of $14,000 for my Fusion and the $32,0000 sticker price of the Jeep? Is me hoping for trade + $15,000 financed out the door unrealistic or doable with proper negotiation. Not afraid to leave but also I don't want to hassle over a few bucks, just want what is honestly a fair to good deal for me. Any thoughts, concerns, input, or experience with Jeep Cherokee's (2014 or 2015 in particular)?

Eric Watson supporting that nothing happened at Bradley Square Mall. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

So, supposedly active shooter on Lee Highway and or Amnicola at Navy and National Guard recruiting offices?   Also, supposedly something at Bradley Square Mall in Cleveland. It is on lockdown from what I can tell.   http://www.wrcbtv.com/story/29563843/officer-involved-shooting-at-us-naval-reserve

Also, my research shows you are supposed to typically avoid dealing with money orders. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I think it was iTunes 12.2.1 that was released yesterday to fix a bunch of initial bugs in the neweest release. For all that may like to know that...

So on iOS you can use Google, Amazon, or iTunes. Buy music from Apple, burn to CD, whatever. It is DRM free. What iPod do you have? I'll send you a prepaid shipping label if you want;) Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Click Music. Click "My Music". Select Artist. Where it shows the multiple albums, click the three little dots on the top pane to the far right. There you can play the entire artist selection or add it to "Up Next" basically meaning your play queue. Or you can simply click the three little dots on your artists page where it shows the artists name. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  Good question, I think the only option is either that they pay for me and nothing else, or they pay for me and 57% of the premium for family coverage and I cover the rest for family.   EDIT: Let me put it this way. I have been going to an "insurance meeting" for 3 years now yearly and I have only ever heard of family being optional. I also spoke with HR yesterday about exactly what I am disccusing in this thread and she told me she thought I should drop family coverage and go for catastrophic coverage for my Wife.

In a nutshell, I have been paying for "family" coverage through my employer. My employer covers my costs entirely, and family coverage is availible for $370.34/month pre-tax dollars. So, since I'm in the 15% tax bracket, for the sake of the arguement I'll use 85% of $370.34 for comparying costs. Currently, I'm paying $3,777.468 yearly for my Wife to have coverage. I think last year she probably used $0 benifit of this. I got to thinking (since it is "open enrollment" at my employer this month) that we could find a policy cheaper since it is a group policy at work and thus affected by co-workers and their families. I was told the check with Farm Bureau in Cleveland. They sent me 4 quotes, and I am heavily tempted by "catastrophic) coverage for her with a $5,000 deductible. However, none of the plans meet the requirements of the Affordible Care Act, and thus unless we could qualify for an exemption I believe we would be taxed/penalized 2% of our income. In this scenario, using last year's $20,300 standard deduction, our current taxable income is roughly $32,436. I think I would pay 2% of that, or $648.72 at the end of the year. If I were to make the switch, my plan would be to save-up basically an emergency fund for emergency services for her if needed. Then I would start saving that extra towards a house. So, I have attatched to this what I currently have, and then the four quotes that were sent to me. So, the numbers: Currently, $370.34 monthly pre-tax, would be $314.79 after that amount was taxed in my pocket if I did not have to pay this. My current plan through employer that she has: (can click on images to make them larger) The four quotes: I am not sure of specifics, but the $53/month major medical coverage quote is very tempting. I would be saving $261.79/month or $3,141.48/year. $648.72 would be taked for the penalty. Total calculated savings ~$2,492.76 Maternity coverage is not included in any of these quotes, but I don't know what to think exactly about that. My plan has been to go back to the employer plan once we have kids. Since open enrollment is every year at the same time, I figure that 3 months are the longest until open enrollment. Thoughts? Foolish to consider?

  The problem with this "solid answer" is that it is still grey. What if you wake up in the morning, drink one beer because you are that guy, at what point are you able to carry again? A few hours? That afternoon? The next day automagically? What about cough syrup?   5 shots of vodka would leave you with impaired judgement a lot longer than the lightest of beers. It is a very vague area unfortunately.   Ultimately, I feel it falls into the worse area possible: Common sense. Have one beer at home and then an hour or two later go to town carrying your gun? I like to think you wouldn't be prosecuted for anything. Several hard shots and then try open carrying through the mall? That would and should be consequential.

So, had been looking forward for the past few weeks to photographing fireworks. I had never tried that before. It really isn't that hard, but I wasn't really satisfied with the results. I wasn't able to get a good scenic location, was too close (because ultimately did not know exactly where to expect them). Though, there are a few towards the end that I consider keepers. Here are all 37 I took. Really would like another "chance", perhaps in Chattanooga or someplace similar, in which the fireworks are shot out over water or something like that. Was rushed the entire time, didn't quite get to setup as I had hoped. I learned very quickly that with too long of exposures the firework would "blur". The "crisp" ones were much shorter at a slightly larger aperture. Used: Canon 6D and 50mm STM

G u n o w n e r s c l u b . c o m Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

What, www.gunownersclub.com is censored? Reasoning? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Gunlistings.org Armslist.com Gunownersclub.com Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk