TMF

Awesome! Thanks for chiming in. Billet uppers only for this one looks like. Can't wait to have one in my hands.

I wouldn't even have a problem with them using deadly force on this guy to protect themselves from harm, but they didnt even manage to hit him yet hit two women on a crowded street. Friggin amateur hour. I don't value the life of a criminal over that of a cop, nor do I expect a cop to, but I do expect them to value the life of a law abiding citizen over that of their own. I realize there is no requirement to do that, but it's implied. If they were in fear of great bodily harm and felt the need to use deadly force, they should have used another means instead of shooting wildly into a crowd; they should have known they were completely incapable of using their sidearms accurately.

I have two forged uppers with a CMT logo on the side in my closet, which I bought from those guys a few months ago. This is why I want to clarify.

That's why I chose the flooring I did. There is so much color variation in the grain that it matches virtually anything and makes it easy to conceal/camouflage damage with a little stain here and there.

This is the reason all the ones I currently own are my own builds; well that and I tend to build around the extra parts I have. But I have a pretty specific idea of what I'm building when I do it, so it isn't cheaper for me to buy one complete off the shelf since a bunch of the stuff I may not even want on there. Big one is usually barrel, sights and handguards. No point in buying one if I'm gonna change all that anyways.

Sure, I've seen them new priced around $750 online, but after shipping ($15-20), FFL fee ($15-25) and TICS ($10) it starts to get up there. Even buying a $750 rifle from Wally World means you're tacking on another $80 bucks in tax and TICS. Cheaper to buy from a private seller at a gun show or face to face. Not knocking it, just saying you have to look at more than sticker price. The only price that matters is out the door.

Probably cheapest is to buy a used one in fair condition. Tax and background make starter rifles more expensive off the shelf. I've built almost all mine and it isn't cheaper per se, especially if you're buying other whiz bang stuff to put on it, such as rail systems or go fats gear. You can get a nice used one for about $700 whereas a new one off the shelf is gonna push $900 after tax and TICS, or shipping, if you go that route. Unless, of course, you get one of those cheapo sport rifles that S&W or DPMS make. Those start around $600-650 and they're nice enough. Just plastic lower I think.

This isn't a battlefield response. Either on the battlefield or in the states, if someone shoots at you then you can defend yourself with deadly force. If a 15 year old kid shoots at me in the US or Iraq I'm gonna put holes in him. Same for an elderly guy. It isn't about me not discriminating, it's about THEIR BULLETS not discriminating. Their bullets are just as capable of hitting and killing me if they came from the gun of any other criminal. It's sad this guy was killed. He may well have been out of his mind. However, I don't think it's appropriate to make judgements about the cops simply due to this guy's age.

Antagonize? They were called and then shot at when they attempted to investigate the call. I'm no Sherlock Holmes, but I'm pretty sure that any officer in the world would interpret the situation as deadly. They responded with less than lethal force, twice. They were then shot at some more and they defended themselves. What else do you want them to do? They had no choice. We don't know that "waiting it out" was a viable option since we weren't there. Maybe it was, maybe it wasn't. What I do know for sure is that they had the right to defend themselves when they were shot at. You can't shoot at police because you think they're "antagonizing you" as far as I know, so I'm trying to do the mental gymnastics it takes to arrive at the conclusion these officers did something wrong.

I'm pretty sure it's standard for anyone, LEO or not, to react to being shot at by shooting back. I dunno, is that just me?

Ha, right? I hate that guy! Just ranting though. It makes me upset to see a personality deficient cop push around a bunch of young girls. I realize they're not all like this. I'm sure plenty of cops encounter carriers in the similar scenarios and treat them with the respect a law abiding citizen deserves, it's just that we don't see that posted to YouTube. Been a high density of cop hating threads on here lately though. I hate crappy cops as much as the next guy but seems like we've suddenly had an influx of them.

Ugh, this guy. I try to imagine my father, who was an LEO, handle this situation. I imagine he would have shown up at the request of the management, spoke with the patrons then asked the management why the hell he was called. At no time would his attitude would have been with these patrons, since they were obeying the law and never asked to leave. He would have told the management not to waste his time further and explained to him how the laws work. Unbelievable the attitude of this cop. Especially the parts where he gets pissy about IDs and the camera. There's no reason he couldn't have been up front and honest about why he as there, what his role was and what the limits of his authority were. "I don't know if I crime has been committed and that's why I need the ID of people who aren't even armed?" Ugh, one of these days this crap is going to turn me into one of those OC morons who troll for confrontation with police. We need more videos of cops doing the right thing, but I guess those videos don't get uploaded to YouTube or shared on here.

Ya know, I'm not one for starting sh** with cops, but screw these guys. Legally carrying girls being interrogated for what? I guess if it wasn't for the idiot cop standing in the background WITH HIS LONG GUN AT THE READY, and the surly attitude of the cop I wouldn't really care about the cop checking on these ladies at the request of the management, but there is no rule against an officer being personable and polite. He handled that like these ladies were up to no good. He could have achieved the same results and answers by being a nice guy and making the exchange pleasant for all parties. I would have told this guy to cuff me or piss off.

Even the real EOTechs had similar problems when they were first becoming popular. Those first ones we were issued a decade ago had battery pack problems.

  I'd advise against it.  It only took a few shots on one of my ARs to kill mine.  I suspect it would be the same with at shotty.  If you have a tactical .22 this would be a good candidate for it.

Any update on which type of upper this is?

  If it was that easy then why did the grand daughter call the police?  Certainly they could have done the same if it wasn't such a big deal.   Bottom line, when guns are pulled and shots are fired the police are expected to intervene.  100% of the time that police intervene in such a situation there are people who say they shouldn't have.    I'm going to always defer to the guys who were getting shot at.  The police were trying to contain the situation using less than lethal force.  If they went in there heavy handed with the intention of killing this guy they wouldn't have used tear gas or diversionary devices.  They tried to employ less than lethal force and were engaged with lethal force.  I'm not sure why people think the bullets coming out of his gun are any less dangerous simply because the guy was old.  Bullets don't discriminate; they kill cops just as easy regardless of who is firing them.  The cops didn't initiate fire, they returned it.  I would expect anyone here would return fire at someone shooting at you, regardless of age.

The EPA thing is newsworthy to me.  It sounds to me like the "enforcement" going on could have been done with a letter or with a couple of inspectors and local law enforcement, if they thought there would be a confrontation.  Showing up in body armor with an assault force is rediculous.  It is either intimidation or them trying to justify the existence of their tactical gear.  Unless there is some intel otherwise indicating that these miners were armed and hostile, I don't see why they would need sooper dooper assaulters.  Sounds like a bunch of chodes trying to play Delta Force.  If that's what they want to pretend, they should have joined the military. 

She had no case.  She was not discriminated against by her employer, nor did she claim to be.  To me this sounds like a disgruntled employee looking for a payday.  If such discrimination existed there would be a case there for those employees, but as far as I know they aren't suing.  Such a rediculous case to begin with.  I don't believe any of the claims here are true.

Yup, I bought a fake once but knew it was a fake at the time of purchase.  In Afghanistan Hadj will sell the knockoffs made in China.  I bought it for the purpose of putting it on my .22, since it seemed to still function properly in terms of zeroing the sight.  It cost $50 bucks and was so true to detail I would challenge most people's ability to tell the difference by just a cursory inspection of it mounted on a rifle.  Of course, I decided it was a good idea to try and shoot it off a 5.56 at some point.  Bad idea.  It killed the sight.  Seemed to work great on a .22.    I'll most likely pick up another one at some point for my .22 S&W and not break it this time.  I think these things were originally made by the Chinese for Airsoft guns, and they are such good replicas that folks are selling them as the real deal.  It's fraud as far as I'm concerned and a crime.  I would suggest that anyone in the market for an EOTech buy from a reputable dealer or a person they know (if they're buying used).  Gun show EOTechs?  Negative Ghostrider... don't do it.

  Well I think you're missing the point.  They didn't go in there to shoot someone.  They went in there to make an arrest on someone who had threatened a person with a weapon, who then called the police.  When the police showed up to investigate they were shot at.  I'm not sure what the police were supposed to do.  They had to intervene and make an arrest.  They tried and were shot at.  They had no choice but to shoot back.  107 years old or not, that's a pretty simple equation.  If this person was 40 years old I don't think too many people would disagree with the actions of the officers.  How does the fact he's 107 years old make his bullets any less deadly?

Ugh, that's supposed to be "get shot" not "get shit". Stupid tapatalk autocorrecting then not letting me edit my post for some reason.

I'm not saying this wasn't tragic, but what are officers supposed to do? They had to secure the scene. They cant just leave after a person pulls a gun on someone and fires shots. They have to make an arrest. They did everything they could within reason to get this guy to surrender. He didnt. He tried to kill the officers that were making the arrest. What should they have done? Get shit because they feel bad this person is 107?

I'm so bad about this. My wife puts the registration with the sticker in my truck and tells me to out it on. Then it sits in my glove box for several months until I dig something out of there and see the sticker staring at me.

Well, yeah. If the entire police department is rendered ineffective by a standoff it is putting the greater public at risk. Not every PD has dozens of cops they can just throw at a problem for days at a time without neglecting all other duties to the community. As a tax payer I have no problem with officers incorporating those cons in their course of action development. And we're not exactly talking about one or the other here in terms of them deciding not to preserve life because they chose to make entry. They didn't intend to shoot this guy. They tried multiple less than lethal means in order to incapacitate him before he was shot. Obviously those means didnt work. That happens sometimes. Age means squat to me. I had a 15 year old boy unload half an AK mag on me from 20m away while I rode in the back of a truck. If I had the opportunity I would have shot him deader than Elvis. Same goes if he was 107 years old.