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I am going to add another forum in that group for non-firearms related. Cigars, toilet paper, good whiskey, etc.

This is now live.

I really hate to see all this crazy stuff happening. But somehow I don't feel any compassion for the people that haven't bought at least a few guns and a few boxes of ammo over the last few years of milk and honey plenty and cheap. I recall the price gouging after Sandy Hook, I had a friend who personally saw in New Orleans gun show, bricks of .22lr going for $250, and I saw a guy on gunbroker pay $125 for 1,000 large rifle primers. We as humans are our worst enemies in times like these. People tend to panic and that doesn't solve any problems. I wouldn't doubt .22lr going thru the roof and not seeing any for a few years again. It is similar to our grandparents and some of our parents generation: keep food in your pantry in case of a snow storm, hard times or whatever. We are far from wealthy, but we keep food in our pantry, have a nice raised bed garden and we can do without toilet tissue if it comes down to that.

This all reminds me of the 5 year long .22 ammo shortage, that all started with the Sandy Hook shooting. Every day you had all of these old, bored retired guys waiting in line at the sporting goods counter at their local Wal-Mart. All waiting to buy their daily allotment of 2 bricks of .22 ammo. They were all either stockpiling it in their basements. Or else reselling it at gun shows and swap meets for triple what they paid for it. Now there's .22 ammo up the wazoo... Or at least was until this insanity started. It's not the Coronavirus that scares me. It's all the idiots responding to it with their lunatic mentality. This morning I was going to go to Wal-Mart to pick up a few things. I got there 3 or 4 minutes before they opened at 7:00 AM, and they were lined up around the store. I made a U-Turn and went home. I don't need to put up with that silly bull$h!t. Fist fights over toilet paper? They're all nuts! I told my wife to start ordering that kind of stuff on line. I don't care if it costs more, or if I have to pay shipping. It's better than shopping with a bunch of crazy idiots.

What if I set it up as a Benefactor Only forum?

Yeah, the media is a little bitch. Fox is the only one I care to watch. All the rest are all out communists.

How did this escape notice? New from Ruger, the 9mm PC Charger pistol: https://ruger.com/products/pcCharger/models.html

Picked up these two beauties for my personal collection. the steel match weight (11oz) adds a nice balance to the full frame pistol

Love hurts: Attached bald eagles fall from sky in Red Bank March 23rd, 2020 | by Emily Crisman, compiler (Chattanooga Times Free Press) Facebook photo by TWRA / Two bald eagles remain attached after falling from the sky in Red Bank, Tenn., March 22, 2020. While doing their part to grow the population of their protected species, two bald eagles fell from the sky while still locked together in Red Bank on Sunday. Tennessee Wildlife Resources Agency officers and a representative of a local wildlife rehabilitation agency placed towels over the lovebirds' heads to keep them calm, at which point they separated from each other, according to a TWRA Facebook post. Sometimes love hurts, but the post said the birds are OK. Biggest excitement in Red Bank in years.

No one will know if someone does it on GB. But they will know if they do it here and won’t want to buy anything from them anymore.

Handgun carry in a horse ?? I would think the horse might object to that

Ha, ha, ha. When I first met with my financial advisor I told him I had a pretty high IQ, high enough that I know I have no more chance of picking the right stocks than picking the lottery numbers, and no desire to learn or spend the research time required. That’s his job. Then we talked about guns for two hours.

So I wonder if the current release is pistol or rifle format only? Off the wall thinking, buy the rifle and get the pistol barrel as a backup. Or vice versa. Maybe they will offer different length barrels separately later? Either way, it does look interesting. Personally, I really like the looks of this Ruger release. I would imagine it will put a dent in the PSA PPC sales.

10" barrel would be ideal, would love to try one.

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Wonder how many times we'll see Dr. Fauci in the press briefing room after an interview like this. I find him one of the most reassuring people on the federal government; not having his input for public consumption would be a loss. https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/03/i-m-going-keep-pushing-anthony-fauci-tries-make-white-house-listen-facts-pandemic

When they have idiots grandstanding like that reporter or the one whining about “Chinese virus”; they should be kicked out of there and some with new blood that have reasonable questions we care about, allowed in. The azzhat worded the question so there was no way Trump could addresses it without acknowledging there are people that don’t trust him. We all know that there are people that do not like, or trust Trump. Anyone who’s IQ is higher than their age won’t be needing to hear a discussion of that in a press conference. I would have fired my reporters if they pulled a stunt like that. Pence was doing an okay job, but Trump was being criticized for not being out there. So now he’s out there. You don’t trust the government. We all know that. But this discussion isn’t about your hatred for Trump.

Another thing is people refuse to apply common sense. There is a delicate balance here. For example, doctors have said repeatedly that it serves no purpose to wear a mask, unless you're already sick. Yet I was in the local grocery store and saw countless people wearing them. Then we wonder why there is a shortage of them? I went to fuel up my vehicles yesterday, and the guy at the counter had a bucket full of something that he was washing his hands in after he waited on every person. This crap was dripping everywhere, all over the floor and counter. And he was taking so long to do it, the line was backing up with customers, exposing more people to each other. If he was so damn worried, all he had to do was wear a pair of rubber gloves. The fact is well meaning people are running around scared, and they're NOT making wise decisions in their actions. My grocery store said they were, "conserving plastic bags". For what, I have no idea. You either have bags, or you don't. So I had to wait, again as the line backed up with people standing next to each other, all breathing down each others neck, while she hunted around for a box to put my food in. This is just plain stupid, people. It is accomplishing nothing. If anything it's making matters worse. The biggest thing that seems to be contagious about this virus, is how idiotic it is making people think and act.... And I live in a sleepy little desert town of 50,000 people, that has not has a single reported case. Common sense is no longer common, that's for damn sure!

Took 79 hours to get my results. (Tested Wednesday at 17:00 and received results today at 0:37) Positive (yea). I am not totally surprised I am positive. My wife was tested Positive back on March 11. I have had even less symptoms than she did. Basically last Wednesday I cut the yard and afterward had that blah feeling you get when you know you are coming down with a cold or a mild flu. My temp was slightly elevated. With the situation of our household, I went in to the Vanderbilt Walk-in to be tested. That took 4.5 hours of waiting during which I slept in the car. By the time they called me, my temp was normal. Since Thursday morning I have felt fine. Such an odd virus that makes some Folks so sick and some barely notice (fingers crossed nothing changes for me). Demographically, I am 50 (51 this coming Saturday ) in decent health. I was treated for Hodgkins Lymphoma back in 2001-2002 but I feel I am fully immune system recovered. I hope your friend is doing well and continues to do well. Remind them to set up their Myhealthatvanderbilt account to get their results.

Well actually the alpha wolves have no need to shop for ammo.

Conspiracy Theories, Coronavirus, TGO and YOU For as long as I can remember, TGO has never really provided "safe waters" for people who want to preach conspiracy theories and rile-up the masses. There are plenty of places for that sort of thing on the Internet and yes sometimes the conspiracy enthusiasts (or nuts, if you so prefer) are proven right in the end. But since there are so many other places for it and since we feel that the ravings of fringe believers tends to bring down the property value, we prefer that our members engage in discussions based in reality. Lately the moderators have begun removing posts fanning the flames of conspiracy around the COVID-19 novel coronavirus pandemic. Generally speaking, I am supportive of their actions. Here's why: Priorities First and foremost, we have a present problem to deal with so let's start by putting our focus there. We have members who are and have been personally affected by COVID-19 and chances are this is just the beginning. If we are going to invest our mental and emotional energies into something, let's invest them in encouraging, supporting and helping our own community. Respect Again, we know that we already have members of TGO affected by this pandemic. So far they (and we) have been fortunate and it's turned out well. That could change. We don't want that to happen, but the statistical projections indicate that by the time the dust settles none of us will have many degrees of separation from someone that died as a result of the virus. I just think maybe it's a little disrespectful to the people currently fighting this virus and eventually to those who lose the battle for us to sit around and imagineer boogeymen behind a virus that science currently says evolved naturally. Stay In Your Lane, Bro Following right in behind the matter of respect is the simple fact that unless you're an educated, degreed, certified ass-kicking virologist, geneticist, research scientist, or have data from a respected source that is... you should probably stay in your lane. Remember the Great Toilet Paper Shortage of 2020? That happened because social media said there was a shortage of toilet paper. So the people believed it, reacted like scared sheep, and ran right over the edge of the cliff with arms full of Charmin. There's no reason for us to allow the next big social media fear-fest to start with or take root on TGO. We can control what happens here, so our intent is to manage it so that there's at least one place you can visit online that doesn't feel like the lunatics are running the asylum. You're welcome for that. Even if you don't appreciate it right now. And So What If That Conspiracy Theory Is Accurate? The President, love him or hate him, has already said that there are going to be consequences on the other side of this current situation for the way that China mishandled this. Even if they didn't bio-engineer it, their government hid the outbreak from the world until it was busting out of their borders. So far the Prez has done everything he's said he would do... right or wrong... so we can be pretty confident that the US isn't going to just let this slide. So, even if the latest conspiracy theory is accurate... you and I can't do a thing about it. Establishing and maintaining a military to preserve our sovereignty, the strength of our borders, and the security of our interests is the one thing that the government should be doing. It's maybe the only reason the government should exist if you ask some. But they are equipped to do something about it. Not us. Not even Chuck Norris. Let's let the government handle the boogeyman. And if they need our input on that, there will be an appropriate time to tell our elected representatives what we'd like to see done. And I'm sure that our actual scientists will be following up on all credible leads that help them expedite a treatment or vaccine for COVID-19. So if that takes them back to a secret lair somewhere in Communist China where they're having unprotected sex with bats while eating live frogs... so be it. In the meantime, let's stay grounded in reality here. It's scary enough and it requires our full attention.

The round has probably pretty much shot its wad at 14" and the velocities at 15, 16, 17, and 18 all reflect basically the same velocity when you account for standard deviation and extreme spread.

Cut him down.

I imagine the horse would appreciate a judicious application of lube on whatever you decide to carry “in the horse”,

Just let the horse carry it

I have 2 inbound. Want to see how they work for my G48.

From my experience, carbine-length barrels still give better velocity. Even a 147 loaded with a small dose of fast burning powder (Hodgdon Titegroup, for example) still gains 100-150 FPS over a Glock 34 and the 34 is probably on the higher end of pistol velocities. This type of load is the one that should not, theoretically, see much (if any) gain. With some hot-loaded 115s, the gain will probably be even more.

You have to be creative for your own situation. When my kids were little I kept a loaded gun in the top of the closet. All I had to do was stand up and grab it. I took it with me or secured it when I got up. I have plenty of semi-auto carry guns, but use a revolver for a nightstand gun. No worries about bumping the trigger, safeties, or my wife not being able to operate it. I don’t have kids around and can just leave guns laying out, but a revolver is harder for a small child to fire or bump into something and have a discharge. Like most here; I wouldn’t use a mechanical device that may/may not open.

I'd be interested to know at what barrel length the returns in velocity start to diminish. There can't be very many 9x19 rounds designed for use in barrels longer than probably 5-6" or so...

I have two of the Gun Vault nightstand safes, one biometric and one with the finger keypad entry. From a security standpoint I don’t think that either one would slow down a determined/knowledgeable thief more than a minute. They would just be too easy to defeat with a well placed shim or screwdriver. I have them just to keep my kids from getting ahold of a couple guns that I want to have handy around the house. One goes on my nightstand, another at the other end of my house. I would absolutely buy the keypad entry model again, as I have had not a single issue. It runs off of one 9v battery that I change every January when I do the smoke detector batteries. I have had the safe for about 7 years. It is currently available on Amazon for $70ish. I would not buy the biometric version again. I’ve had mine about 5 years, and I think they currently go for $115ish. My issue was not so much the biometric not working properly, mine was that it was incredibly sensitive, which could make some think it is finicky. I’ve seen several videos on YouTube of the biometric being opened with random fingers and even a dog paw, leaving one to worry that their child would be able to gain access, which is of course what we are trying to prevent. The issue I ran into, is you have to slide your finger consistently every time, and if there is any variation/damage to your fingerprint it will not recognize it. Something as simple as a small paper cut deformation to your finger tip will make it not work. Slight moisture residue from washing your hands will make it not work. I can only imagine that blood on your hands would make it not work. Mine runs off of one 9v, though I have seen some that run off AAs. My buddy has an RFID version from another company that came with a bracelet and a keycard, neither of which does he keep on him much of the time so he regrets that purchase.

I finally decided that if the "experts" knew anything I don't, they'd be investing their money instead of mine. That decision, along with leaving emotion out of it as well as reading and learning, has paid me great dividends.

I was 52 in 2000 and way over loaded on tech stocks, and I had thought about retiring at 55. Well I thought that dream had ended. I didn't sell, I continued buying but in a more diverse way. When I was 55 I had recovered all I had lost and more and told my boss I was ready to retire if he didn't keep me happy. At 57 the corporation was offering buy outs and I qualified, so I bailed, that was 2005. I road out the 2008 dip without much concern and I plan to ride this one out. By the way I have done most of my own investing since I started, I read a lot and still do. The one time I decided to put some money in the hands of an "expert" he managed to lose half of it in about two years and talked me out of buying Apple at a split adjust price that would have been a $1/share.

I live around the Germantown area of Nashville. Outside for some fresh air yesterday as I took a 30 min walk was a shut down farmers market, bicentennial mall with only a dozen or so other folks walking around, damage still visible from the tornado's that seem like forever ago despite it being less than a month, and businesses with signs on the door telling folks which delivery sites they could order food from in their last gasp to keep a cash flow going. Seeing the once vibrant economy of my neighborhood dying in slow motion is probably just as if not more depressing than anything on the internet and TV...but I need the exercise.

Absolutely agree. I'm at the saturation point, worrying about my own health, as well as my family's health. Not to mention whatever is left of my retirement fund. I did a bunch of yardwork and took an old car out for a spin today to relax a little.

One things for sure, even if the world wasn't going to end, people are hell bent on talking it into existence. Go outside and get some fresh air. People need to put down their phones and computers and focus on something other than doom and gloom. I would love to see a 14 day internet ban so people can stop being crazed idiots.

As a business owner many times over the years I've had to divulge bad information to employees in steps to control the crash. Can you imagine if Trump had come out day one and throwed it all out there about what they knew was going to need to happen? You think the run on TP and ammo has been bad. This is unprecedented territory and there is no playbook. I don't envy any of the people trying to run towns, counties, states or countries. I'll do my best to protect family and friends. I don't expect the government to bail me out or protect me. That's how I was raised.

https://ruger.com/products/pcCarbine/specSheets/19122.html

I really hope that practice comes to an end. It would be great if this event causes a seismic shift in our policy about sending a lot of different sectors of business overseas.

You know what? I used to be one of those people who was all over CTD every time they did this. But no longer. I don't blame them. Not one bit. If the public is stupid enough to act this way, then they deserve it. Seriously. And they've done it several times in the last decade regarding guns and ammunition. Starting way back when Obama got elected, and several times since. Time after time they do nothing until something like this happens, then run out in a panic and decide to buy. Not a single ounce of foresight, or common sense among the whole idiotic bunch. So the hell with them. They're ripe for picking, and they all deserve to be picked clean. They all seem to make a profession out of acting like unprepared fools. CTD simply proves it. And why shouldn't they? These nit wits don't deserve a break. They live their lives in a cloud of ignorance, then start running around in a blind panic, screaming at the sky as soon as something gets the slightest bit out of whack. Guns, ammo, magazines were all quite literally, "dirt cheap", ever since Trump won the election. Did they buy when all of these good prices and selection were available? No. So then let the stupid idiots pay through the nose now. I no longer look at it as, "price gouging". I see it as idiots paying what they deserve to pay, for exercising their right to be idiots. The old saying is as true today, as it was long ago. "Run with the sheep, and you will be slaughtered".

People are complete idiots. Ever since Trump won the election, guns and ammo have been cheap, and plentiful as dirt. Did they take advantage of the supply and cheap prices? Hell, no. They all waited, and now they're all running over each other, emptying the shelves of everything. Idiots all!

CTD? I remember buying from them before they decided to gouge their customers several years ago. If they sold ammo at 1 cent a round I could never bring myself to order from them again.

Exactly. A fair price is whatever a buyer is willing to pay and a seller is willing to accept.

CTD asking $35 for a box of 50 Tula 9mm, is price gouging, and taking advantage of folks in a panic and don’t know better. Folks bidding up a 1000round box of 9mm to $600 is supply and demand. Is it stupid for someone to pay that much, probably.

Good on you gents who keep it stacked to the ceiling. Seeing 1K rnd cases of 9mm go for $600 on GB who can blame anyone wanting to cash in those without any sense. Thought I was in my forever house 2 years ago, was stacking it high before wife finally conceded to allow us to move out of CA. Paying to move palates of ammo (and I sold a bunch before leaving) made me rethink how much I needed for a temporary living situation and having to move it again. If this could have only been last year!.

Cheaper Than Dirt

Appalling that so few understand basic economics. If it wasn't for the ability to charge higher prices in times of scarcity, there would not be anything available for those who truly need it. We laugh at those who are desperately buying a gun and ammo when they suddenly feel danger. But if you TRULY need a gun and don't have one, wouldn't you be willing to pay a lot more than when there is no threat? The high prices also serve as a strong lesson that it is much cheaper to be prepared for an emergency than having to react and pay the higher prices.

I hope everything turns out great for all concerned.

I remember a time when there was no such thing as bottled water except maybe tonic water or seltzer to make cocktails with until Perrier came along. Then everyone had to start buying water they’re already paying for at home or getting free anywhere they go, lol. It really wasn’t all that long ago. It’s amazing we survived.