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I'm going to offer a few thoughts for perspective. Have you ever been somewhere where you just felt like you didn't belong? Maybe there was nothing obvious. Likely nothing was said. But, you just felt like you didn't fit in. Many of us have never had that experience - or would need to really stretch our thinking to do it. Looking for a church is a perhaps a good analogy. If you've ever left home and felt compelled to find a church in a new town - it can be daunting. I recently had a family member move to Murfreesboro. For a couple of years they tried probably a dozen churches. They were at one of the bigger ones for about 6 months because their kids went to school with a lot of the kids at that church. They really put in the work, but still ended up leaving. When I was talking to my family member about it, she said, "there are some really great people there - but after 6 months I've got people still introducing themselves like I'm a visitor multiple times - and I don't really know that we're wealthy enough to afford to be able to go to church here." There's a lot in that statement that breaks my heart - but there's a lot of truth, too. There's nothing obviously wrong with that church - they're serving a lot of people - but maybe there's more that they could be doing. -- When it comes to the 2A community - maybe more than one thing can be true at the same time. I'm going to explore that a little bit in this post. 1. The NRA as it exists today is doing just fine - Its membership is as large as it's ever been. It raises more money than it ever has. It has a string of legislative and judicial wins at the local, state, and federal level. As an organization, it is feared by it's opponents, and may be the most effective lobbying group that's ever been. When many of us go to the conventions - we see a floor packed with guns and gear. We hear people speak that are talking about things that we care about. It's probably the furthest thing from most of our minds that most everyone there looks like us. And, that's fine on the surface. The NRA is doing great. Why change something that is doing fine? If people don't feel welcome, that's their problem, not mine. I'm welcoming and affirming and tired of people telling me that I'm the problem. All of the above can be true, and this likely is pretty accurate for most of us. But, something else can be true, too. 2. The NRA as it exists today isn't going to be enough to see us through the fight that is coming - The conditions on the ground are changing. I'm convinced that we're going to see gun regulation be a more dominant force in our political arena in the next few years than it's ever been. Opponents are mobilized, growing, and increasingly well funded. The NRA (as a proxy for all of us) is not ready for this coming fight. We need as many allies as we can get - and what's worked so far - being a culture that's predominantly included white, middle class, generally "conservative" males - isn't going to get us where we need to go. We're going to need a bigger team. -- I think a lot of us read stuff about diversity and inclusion - and we're made to feel like we're somehow the problem. We're tired of being made out to be the problem. I'd love to redirect our focus a bit. We all view things through a lens of our experience. We can't change that. But, occasionally something comes along to put a scratch on that lens and make us think. Let's go back to that church hunting analogy a bit. Many of you who've gone through this process would likely echo feeling something like this. My family member did wind up at a church where they're happy and engaged. When talking to her about it, she mentioned that the first Sunday that they were there people went out of their way to make them feel included. People didn't just introduce themselves, the pastoral staff met them and learned about them. Other kids introduced themselves and showed their kids where to go. People invited them to lunch after church. They made sure they knew about small groups. All of this could seem overwhelming - unless you're looking for a community to get engaged in. Then, you see it through a perspective of people going out of their way to make you feel welcome. That church was fine before this family got there - but when they showed up they went out of their way to make them feel welcome. And now, they're all better for it. If I were to extend that out to the NRA (again as a proxy for all of us) what does that look like? Let's say I'm a young Hispanic man here in Nashville, or a single black mother in Memphis who has bought a gun to defend her family, or maybe I'm a dad in government housing who can here gunshots weekly from my stoop as my kids play in the yard. Let's say I've joined the NRA to learn more about guns because that wasn't a part of my upbringing. I get a copy of American Rifleman or American Hunter in the mail every month. How do those publications speak to me? What would those publications look like if they included stuff that was important to the non-white, non-suburban, non middle class male reader? Off the top of my head: Let's talk Philando Castile - here was a young (black) man who did everything you're supposed to do as a permit holder when engaging with law enforcement. He notified them of his permit, was respectful, and didn't go anywhere near his gun - and still wound up shot. That's terrifying - and the NRA was silent on it. Let's talk firearm security when a $1000 safe may not be an option Let's talk firearm safety and handling in an environment where people aren't going to look at you crossways just because you're there Let's talk cultural issues where your family and your community may look at you crossways because the only people they know with guns are thugs Let's really open up some channels with law enforcement, and be an advocate, and have some hard conversations about interactions with our members who are terrified that they're going to get shot for something stupid. A lot of things can be true at the same time in life. As I look at our community of gun owners at large right now - we're as strong as we've ever been. But, that likely isn't strong enough to get us where we need to go next. America is getting browner. That is something that many of us welcome and celebrate. The 2A community of the future can't look like the one of today if we're going to remain as strong in future generations as we have in this past generation. Maybe the point of this thread isn't necessarily to call us out on doing something wrong - rather it's to start a conversation about how we can be more welcoming - even if at times we go out of our way to do it. How much stronger would the 2A community be if it were in fact a leader when it comes to inclusion? That's the thing. Leaders don't just show up one day with a group that is like, "yeah, I guess we'll follow you." No. Leaders create a space that people want to be involved in - and know that in doing so everyone is better.

No, I look nothing like Mr.Sutherland, but I was a huge fan of his show 24. My wife and I are solidly middle class with three adult college educated kids, and conservative upbringings. That has changed. We no longer consider ourselves a part of any party or group. I come from a hard working family where I saw my grandfather work side by side with game show host Wink Martindale, farmed his own land, and raised animals. Everyone in the family was expected to participate. My wife is college educated, and worked her way up from loading planes at FEDEX , to management, and finally a regulatory compliance SME at FEDEX World Headquarters. I’m a 90% disabled veteran, and a government employee scheduled to retire in a few years. The highlights of my military career were being on the Ft.Gordon, Ga. SRT team, and being a part of the service members who had the swiftest victory in combat history during Desert Storm. I’m mostly conservative in my thinking, but I have a soft spot for those who struggle. It’s not always that they are lazy or don’t work, as David and Mc mentioned, lots of times the are profiled and discarded simply because of the pigment of their skin. What I’ve enjoyed about the last ten years on TGO is meeting members in person. We’ve had great transactions, and even better interactions. I don’t know if it’s upbringing that causes people to be prejudiced, but I do know that spending time with someone who doesn’t look like you, or share your views greatly benefits all parties involved. For those who have never met me, and only know my Sutherland Profile, here are a few photos.

I'm taking next week off of work, so I'll pick some time and listen to the podcast with a clear head, hoping to be exposed to a new viewpoint, or learn something I didn't know before pressing play. Just from the debate it's provoked here, I think it will be time spent well. Now, I get that whenever anyone mentions "diversity and inclusion" it's almost an instinctual response for many to think that you're being asked to feel sorry for being white, or having privilege (however it's defined in context), or anything else that you feel chips you down to raise up someone else. It doesn't have to be unless you're committed to feeling such. I'm white, well off, fat & happy, and I'm not apologizing for a damn thing. But I'm also cognizant that my experiences (good and bad), are mine alone, and I know only what I can assume about others until I take the time to learn and explore, or simply listen to their stories. Even then, I'll never have the full effect that being anything other than a white male brings, so I'll only ever be able to know so much. One thing I'm sure of though, is any prejudices applied to me were few and far between, enabling my journey to where I'm at today to be smoother than it would be for someone else of the same skill level, drive, and education in a different skin or gender. It doesn't cost me anything I've earned to acknowledge that, and try to make sure I'm not perpetuating it when I have the chance to influence anything. I see it, and not just at gun shops. It's hard for me to expect anyone to be enthusiastic about 2A culture, when they're ostracized from the time they walk in the door, or would be view suspiciously from the get-go for simply having a firearm...even within the gun community, never mind society and government at large.

Greg, I still would like your thoughts on this. Feel free to PM me if you'd rather. That being said, however, I am going to recuse myself from this thread for the time being. I am not sure that my continued posting within it will add any more value or if it will just muddy the waters further. Let me say one thing before I check out of it, though: My hope from the start was that this particular podcast episode would inspire the Second Amendment community to be more inclusive of others and more welcoming of diversity within our ranks. The response seems to have been, "But aren't we already doing that?" and I would guess that as far as a forum can be, we're not doing a bad job. But my focus wasn't TGO but rather the larger 2A community as a whole. On a forum, it is fairly impossible to ascertain a member's race or gender from a screen-name or an avatar. I bet a lot of people still think @LINKS2K is Keifer Sutherland. My only ask of everyone here is that we not make assumptions from the vantage point of not knowing, and strive to be welcoming by not giving quarter to behavior that would turn people away. When my wife and I were looking for a new home church recently, we visited a lot of them. None of them made us feel particularly unwelcome, but only one of them made us feel like they wanted us there. I want TGO to do that.

All I want is someone who will read and adhere to the constitution. It ain't that hard really.

It's very hard to be responsible in a world full of bad examples. Mostly people are looking for others to change when all they have to do is look in the mirror and change themselves. We live in the finest country in the world and nothing has ever been fair. It never will be. Walk the walk and dam the talk. Sunfish

Diversity and inclusion. I've lived this all my 50+ years without giving it a second thought. I respected everyone that deserved it based on the way they lived , worked and and treated others, never on the color of their skin. The fact that this has become a political talking point for years upsets me to no end. It's a manufactured crisis caused by the previous presidential administration and promoted by the news media. Call me a nut if you want to but that's how I see it. I'm supposed to have white guilt? Why? Who is running away from diversity and inclusion?

My ideas on this subject run pretty deep. I have lived in the black community as the "white boy". Had to listen to white boy jokes when I was the only one late for a manager's meeting (I laughed louder than the joker). And, spent lots of time discussing the issues between the black and white communities. At the time, I was in a new town (Nashville), and didn't know any white folks. Not complaining, mind you. It was a great experience. With that all said, everybody is welcome in my eyes. And, I will do my best to drag ANYBODY into shooting... black, white, gay, female, all of the above. The tone of this thread is that we may all be fundamentally a little racist. In reality, most of my black friends aren't shooters. Hell, most of my white friends aren't either. I live around city slickers. That's not because I haven't been inclusive. It's because it's the way it is. In my humble opinion, taking any action because of someone's skin color can be wrong. I try to treat everybody equally. Recruiting brown people kinda goes against that in my eyes.

I am heading to Florida tomorrow to see the grandkids! I will have a long drive that I can use the time to relisten to this one. I will also take the opportunity to listen closer and see if there are some other things that are more enlightening. If nothing else it did open a conversation about the topic! That alone makes it worth more than any TV show I have seen in decades!

Your badges are crooked! Sorry, that is the marine side of me! All kidding aside thanks for your service from another serived connected disabled vet!

As am I. While both sides throw plenty of poo, the left is particularly obnoxious and hysterical.

While I don’t exactly agree with “hardcore conservatism”, or “ists”, I do want a conservative Supreme Court. I’d like to see a court that leans more to the right for the next 20 or 30 years.

Well I took the plunge today and began setting up to move away from BOA(Bank of America) I got so many good reports about Wilson Bank & Trust that I am going with them. They were all very nice and made you feel like they were glad you were there. That home town bank feeling all banks use to have. There is a juggling act that needs to be done since I am on auto-deposit so I can't move any of my accounts till right after they make the deposit. Then I can pull everything from both of my accounts and close them after I go to Social Security Office and give them new bank accounts and request they use the new account beginning in August. That gives them a month to make the changes. I know a buddy of mine did the same thing but did it a week before his deposit and it took 2 months to get the mess corrected and get him his money. I will sure be glad to get a new bank.

I found out he was cited for drag racing not tampering with a crime scene. I don’t know anything more than that and it is public record.

Oooh that is hitting below the belt man!

Well, he was an MP.

Yep. Swatting at imaginary bugs sure sounds better than muttering obscenities and arguing with spirits.

You know, I am glad that this is making you think about these things but at the same time I wonder why it's making you seemingly obsess over it. Hopefully it is because it caused you to be introspective and ask of yourself the same questions that you're asking here. To answer your question: YES I am saying that, from what I have seen across the spectrum of social media and in person, the majority of people that you see posting online or at gun shops or at the shooting range are white folks just like me and there isn't a whole lot of diversity. What I also have personally witnessed is the difference in how specific minorities are treated when they walk into some gun stores and onto some shooting ranges. If an Asian guy walks into a gun store, no one bats an eye. But if a black guy, a Hispanic guy or a Middle Eastern guy walk into a gun shop, I've personally witnessed them being watched closely by the dudes behind the counter So, am I the only person that notices this? The fact that you're questioning what my motives are suggests that you haven't seen it. But to answer my own question, I know I am not the only one who does. This podcast was a lens into another community's view of the firearms culture and my sincere hope was that people would look through it and see things differently. I had hoped it would help us see things from that community's perspective. But instead I've got folks on TGO, like you, insinuating that there's something wrong with me and that community for seeing and noticing things the way that we do. I'm just going to say it: There's innocent ignorance and then there's willful ignorance, and only the former is forgivable.

The dyed-in-the-wool Harley devout are the people I mentioned in my first post. It's like a religion to them, or a cult. Harley has dared to make something different, such as the Vrod and the Street Rods, and Harley has had the audacity to try to reach a market segment other than this same group of people, all without clearing it with them first. To me, the fact that they have gotten all bent out of shape over this just displays the elitist mentality that I've always seen in them. Yes, I do know a lot of them. "I'm better than you, therefore I ride this, and you can't have one, but if you wish to be counted among the worthy, you must ride one of these." Or something along those lines. A lot of them seem to think Harley should only make whatever model these people ride and cater only to their group. But it's impossible for a company to stay in business that way. Honestly it's what has always turned me off to Harley. I never wanted to be a part of that since I'm more of an independent old coot and I believe that no one is better than anyone else. It's why I've always loved seeing a big group of riders on a widely varied mix of brands. I'm glad Harley is trying to reach different segments of the market. I just hope their "loyal fans" don't sink them in the process.

I dunno. A certain percentage of LEO got jollies out of trying to scare kids when I was a kid, and it hasn't changed. My son can't go anywhere without getting a seatbelt ticket. I know it's a law, but surely they have something more important to attend to.

Wanker.

Bump. . . . . *ducks*

I certainly would hope they have the fortitude to do it.

With Mad Maxine and the other idiots going full retard, I'm expecting a blue trickle.

How white are we? I do not know, nor care what the ethnic makeup of this forum is. I do not recall checking a box to indicate my race when I joined either. Is this something you feel we should apologize for or be ashamed of? I don't think much about another member's skin color unless he or she brought it up in a post. I think that if we ever get serious about getting past racism, that would be the correct mindset. I'm often wrong, however.

https://www.commdiginews.com/politics-2/millennials-understand-constitution-they-dont-care-65322/ One of the most troubling trends that this age group is currently dealing with is the idea that a guy like Bernie Sanders, who once boasted that no one deserves to make more than a million dollars and routinely defends communism, somehow has a legitimate case to be president of the United States. Why could that be? What in the world could be driving all these impressionable young minds to believe in policies that are not only destructive but are completely antithetical to the foundation of the country and what makes it great in the first place? Well, it’s actually quite simple. There have been a million articles out there about how millennials are uninformed as a result of not paying attention or not caring. In fact, it is more likely that millennials know what makes America great and just don’t care. A Pew poll says that 40 percent of young people apparently think that the First Amendment, one of the most important if not the most important pillars of our freedom, should not apply to speech that minorities might find offensive. This clearly implies that young people are familiar with freedom of speech, they know it’s a part of the fiber our country, they just don’t care. Feelings are more important, which leads to the obvious conclusion that feelings have the power to trump any aspect of the Constitution, which is of course extremely troubling. The last poll doesn’t have anything to do with the Constitution and the idea of changing our founding document in order to not hurt anyone’s feelings, but it speaks volumes about the mental fortitude of the millennial crowd. According to a poll taken this past January, 10 percent of college grads (yes, graduated from college) believe that Judge Judy is a Supreme Court Justice. Just let that sink in for a few moments. Young people today believe that socialism is cool, our founding document should be altered in order to not hurt anyone’s feelings and that a television star is a member of the most powerful governing body in the land. If that doesn’t sound a deafening alarm in your head, then I don’t know what will.

First off, thanks to everybody for for your information, advice and patience guiding me to my first AR. I thought y'all might be interested to see how it came out. S&W M&P-15 Optics Ready with Magpul M-lok fore end Bushnell 1-4X24 AR-223 Scope Burris P.E.P.R. mount Magpul pistol grip, sling and MBUS folding sights Tapco butt pad I know its nothing fancy and frankly I didn't want to spend a lot of money. But it suits my needs just fine.

No, not next week!

The Vrod is the coolest modern bike HD made. That it was discontinued was telling of the state of HD. Fun memory.... been riding the dragon all day and it's getting dark so one last pass on my way home. I'm tired so not pushing the pace, just rolling comfortably. This tremendous noise comes up behind me, it's loud over my bike and earplugs. Then blinding headlights begin to appear in my mirrors. I thought was the Cobra club that I'd seen earlier. I turn up the wick a little but it's still right behind me. I decide to put my ego in my pocket and let whoever/whatever that is go past. A guy wearing full leathers goes thundering past on a Vrod and lays a shower of sparks into the next corner. No way. I'm on it and it's all I can do to keep up with this guy. Again, self-preservation kicks in and I back off. As i approach the overlook, I see the guy getting off the bike and decide to stop and chat. Turns out he's been a club racer for years, as evidenced by the well worn, '80's gear he's wearing. The rear tire is a shredded race slick with balls of gooey rubber hanging off both sides. The pegs are heat discolored and beveled back so they're maybe 1-1/2" long. The exhaust has a slot about 1/3rd of the circumference ground into it. His comment... "ya know, these things go pretty good once you make a little clearance. "

Well we are talking about Rob so that was kinda implied.