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I think Dolomite made a lot of very good points. I have often said that all the people who think they are going to just 'head to the country' are going to be surprised to find people like me already there, (figuratively) sitting on my front porch with a shotgun and telling them to get the hell off of my lawn. The only type of event I can think of where I would want to 'bug out' would be if there were a weather related/natural disaster type event that made staying home impossible. Otherwise, all of my food supplies are at home. All of my guns and ammo are at home. My medications are at home. My bed is at home (and if I am going to die in a SHTF situation I'd rather do so in my bed than wallowing in the mud and wondering why I didn't just stay my a** at the house.) Also, as Dolomite pointed out, I know the area around my home. I have well water and there are two wells on the property - the old, insufficient one that has been disused and a newer one that is used. Thing is, the older one is now just a covered shaft - which means I can pop the cover, drop in a tubular well 'bucket' and haul up water out of the ground. I have done it, before. Long term food supplies would be my only, real issue. I have plenty of acreage for a garden but for the most part the soil sucks so that growing large scale crops would be difficult. The land isn't really suited for cattle, either but I could raise a few hogs (am considering doing that soon, anyhow), I have a few chickens (more for egg laying but am also considering adding more for meat) and the land could likely sustain a few goats for meat and milk. I have home canned food in the past so if I had a supply of fresh meat/vegetables/fruits I could preserve them - probably even if I had to use the canner over a fire instead of an electric heat source. There is some game available in my area but I think wild game supplies would 'dry up' pretty quickly. There are places within walking distance where I could catch a few fish, however, and that would probably be more sensible than planning on doing a lot of hunting (although I am not that big a fan of eating fish very often - I eat fish but not on an every day basis - if I am really hungry protein would be protein.) Fishing would make more sense from an energy expenditure standpoint, too - especially if there are places to sit up trot lines, limb lines and so on that won't be scavenged by others. Mostly, though, I would need to have a lot of food stored beforehand if I were going to be facing a long term SHTF event. That said, I think that a much more likely scenario would be one where food/supplies/the grid are interrupted for a matter of weeks or months, not years. Either way, currently I am thinking a lot more about long term or semi-long term food storage than about where I would run away to or what all I would have to take with me. Dolomite also hit the nail on the head about losing one's conscience. We all know what we would do if 'marauders' came to our door looking to take our food. Consider, however, if the people who came to your door were, for instance, a 65 year old grandmother and her two grandchildren - ages 6 and 8 - who had gotten separated from their group and had not eaten in three days. None of the three would likely be bringing any, real skills or needed knowledge to the table and if allowed to hang around they would be nothing more than a drain on already limited resources. Giving them a day or two worth of food and sending them on their way might make you feel a little better but, honestly, that would just be wasting a day or two of food you might need later as it likely won't make much difference in the long run where their survival is concerned, anyhow. Besides, if you give in and give them a few day's worth will you do the same the next time someone comes asking - and the next, and the next? How long could you do that without seriously depleting the supplies you had already decided you needed for the survival of you and yours? On the other hand, is looking into their faces and saying, "Nope, sorry. Wish I could help but I can't. Best you move along, now," something you are prepared to do? Because if you really intend to survive you will probably have to.

I ended up going with the S&W 460XVR. Now I just need to get out and sight the scope in. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

After first taking it from those who are already there. If a person doesn't own the property they better have their supplies loaded and on their way to the bug out location BEFORE anything happens if you plan on being there first. You MUST have your supplies already loaded, tank full of gas and able to take off within minutes if you have ANY hope of beating the mobs. And if you think you have found the perfect spot a bunch of other people are planning to go to the same spot. There are plenty of people who plan on bugging out and I wonder where. Most of them say they plan to head to the hills which is a huge problem because there are already people in those hills living there right now. And those people are going to defend their location or at least I know I will. And don't expect others to openly welcome a large group of people. I know I won't welcome anyone unless they bring a significant skill to the group and honestly I can't imagine what that skill might be that isn't already covered. Anyone who is not a member of my group will be turned away with overwhelming amount of force. I will say this to all of those planning on bugging out to the hills. I will defend what is mine, including land, from any squatters or looters. After all if you show up and try to take what isn't yours you are a thief. That includes wild game, plants or anything on my property even if I do not need it or not using it that stuff is still mine. I may have more than I need to survive but I will not share any of it with complete strangers. I have made preparations to ensure my survivability and I would be a fool to give any of it away to complete strangers. It takes a lot of land to support a person year around. An acre or two isn't going to cut it. It will likely take 10's of acres per person if they plan on foraging or hunting. And what makes the average person think they are going to make it out of a population center before the other 50% of the other people leaving the cities clog the roadways? What is going to happen is the highways are going to clog like Rita/ Katrina leaving them stranded and with the option of walking to the "hills" or walking back to the cities. And when you start walking you are going to be able to carry far less than what you left with or even left behind in your vehicle. Bugging in has some real advantages and if I lived in a city I would, without a doubt, stay put. First is you already have everything you are going to have without the need to transport it to a new location. You can call for help from those around you while in a remote location you cannot call for help. Another big advantage is you know the area. You also know who is friend and who is foe or at least have a good idea. Travelling exposes you to more dangers. It is also easier to defend a building or high rise than a tent in the woods. Those buildings are going to protect you from the elements and be easier to keep warm in and survive in for the average person especially those used to living in the city. Food, at least initially, will be easier to come by in the cities as well as potable water. There are literally a few weeks worth of potable water in your water heater and toilet bowls and that is if you don't ration. With rain gutters, collecting water is much easier too. And as disgusting as it might sound cities have tons of rodents that can be harvested for food. If any type of relief or supplies are handed out it is going to be in the population centers first. The average person is going to have a far easier time surviving in the city than in the "hills". But if you must bug out and have any hope of bugging out you must be packed and ready to go in a moments notice. Vehicles have to ALWAYS have the gas needed to make it to that location. When the SHTF gas will be gone within minutes so unless you are at the pumps pumping your gas as it takes place you will not get gas from a pump. You need to also realize that there are going to be a lot more people than just you heading to a bug out location. This is going to clog the roadways like we saw during Rita/Katrina. The only way you might get a head start is if you are in a position to get some notice, like LE, emergency services or the government. Otherwise it is going to be a race to get out and if you are not in the lead you will find yourself stuck in the rear with the pack. And once you are stuck you and your stuff become vulnerable to roaming bands of thugs set on taking your stuff for themselves. And honestly it would be easy pickings. As far as your bug out location you need to own the property you plan to go to. This can give you a little bit of a delay in the squatters that will show up. And once there the squatters are not going to readily leave even if you tell them you own the property. If your bug out location is "public lands" you are not going to be the first there, it will be like winning the lottery if you are. You are going to find yourself surrounded by thousands of others who have the same plan. So, if it is a good spot, you will probably have to fight your way in and once in you will have to constantly defend that location. Most people don't realize that best case scenario crops will be edible in 4 months. If it happened during the summer it would be close to a year before crops can begin to be harvested. So that means you are going to have to transport that much food because you are not going to be able to kill a years worth of food with everyone else trying to do the same thing. And as much as I hate to say it in order to survive people must loose their conscience. They must be willing to turn those less fortunate away unless they bring a substantial advantage to the group. People have this grand illusion that they are going to be able to find virgin land to live off of. Look around, how much public land do you see? And of that how much is going to be free for the taking, not much if any, by the time they make it?

A Tennessee teacher and the teenage former student he was suspected of kidnapping were found in Northern California on Thursday, ending a manhunt that stretched on for more than a month, The Tennessee Bureau of Investigation announced. Tad Cummins, 50, was arrested and 15-year-old Elizabeth Thomas was “safely recovered,” TBI tweeted. Officials planned a news conference scheduled for 4 p.m. ET. http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/04/20/tad-cummins-elizabeth-thomas-found-in-california.html

I've got mine....

I have an impact so don't sweat that ... come to think about it I believe I bought it for those dang KSGs ;o) .. not too much in the gun world requires impact power - ha .. Just come on when you're ready buddy .. ping me and let me know and we'll be sure I can knock the lower out while you wait. Thanks!

Everyone get registered early?

The FFL in Georgia can do it....but you need to see if he will. They won't all do it.

Do tell on the Steyr. I almost bought a GB years ago, but the seller had second thoughts at the last minute.

No. Because whether the guy has a block of steel or not, he'll fall at the same rate.

Can these people worry less about searching everyone for guns and focus on the idiots that decided it was a good idea to attack this guy. I love that the gun was like 1/2% of the story, but becomes the focus. I mean no one shot him, they beat the crap out of him, so can we just remove everyone's hands on the way into the zoo? I am guessing the real motive was that they were mad he did not loan them his phone.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

That sounds great! Don't worry about sending it though, I still owe you a visit to drop off some Simunition ammo and have a lower engraved. I'll just bring my KSG and impact driver when I make the journey and knock it all out at once.

Just wanted to say thank you for starting this thread. Came in a couple days ago. Sorry for the crappy pictures Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The Bike came home today, been out on it a bit. Good Power, good low end which is what i need around the City.

You might contact Paul Wheaton at Permies. He comes into contact with a lot of people who are interested in farming and homesteading in ways that are very in tune with nature. I know he has families that visit his place for months at a time to learn various skills. If the second trailer is decently livable you may be able to find a nice young family that would kill for the opportunity to have land like that to work with. There is also a website WWOOF (called wwoofers which stands for World Wide Opportunities on Organic Farms) which is an international organization of folks who move to different areas to learn farming techniques or just use it as a manner to travel the world on the cheap. I think there is usually a stipend involved but I haven't researched it that much. You would have to do a little due diligence to find the right people and they aren't usually a long term solution. One more possibility (kind of a long shot) is a Canadian named Curtis Stone. He runs a site called The Urban Farmer. He has a business and teaches a ton of classes on how to lease small plots of land in urban areas to farm for locally produced veggies. The lease agreements often include sharing a portion of the food grown so it could be a good source of free healthy food for you. He has a ton of students each year and may know someone local who has been through his course that would be an ideal fit for you Maybe one of those will work for you or maybe they won't but at least it's worth a look, Mark

You might find somebody nearby who would cut up the trees for firewood, assuming they'd be good for that.

Live stock is for true homebody's because it really ties you down. I keep things to where I can travel some in Winter and visit friends and family

Cool...it's been a while since I last saw an 8-track in the center console.

That fireworks thing was pretty cool.

I am no aviation expert but from what I understand the speedometer/speed tracking device looks like it is from a passenger plane? I'm more interested and curious why the "DANGER: EJECTION SEAT & CANOPY" is in English?

Lease the hay fields to someone for the hay (and you make some money) and use as much space around your house as needed for your garden and critters. You can rent the second home, but I would not grant any hunting or farming access. Just find a nice single person or married couple who would want to rent it. Families are a pain to rent to and renting to couple's who aren't married can lead to not getting paid even faster. It should be pretty easy to find someone who would lease for the hay. Make sure to find out what market value is for that around you so you don't get taken advantage of. Ask at the local co-op, I bet someone there could tell you.

Looks really nice to me. If anyone nearby has cows or horses, I'd bet they'd lease/barter for the hay. You could also do hunting leases if you have turkeys and/or deer.

MOAB, shmoab. The British were using the 22,000 pound Grand Slam bomb in WWII. "Guvna, the jerries are giving us a spot of bother" "Well then, determine what a Lancaster bomber can carry and build a single bomb so we might give them a proper rogering"

I like the barter / co-op idea. Possible to lease out sections, so as not to interrupt your shooting? My B-I-L raises cows in South Knox, in the valley, they still share crop. He puts forth his labor and equipment and gets a share of the hay. Depending on your land / water use and management, maybe grazing leases as well? Be super selfish and use what you need and bring in TWRA to help develop the rest as your own private hunting domain? It's a farm right now, but what else could it be...

I absolutely would not sell it. I would also hesitate to bring some other family to live there (if that's what you meant) because these days that can often be WAY more trouble than it's worth ('cause people are awful). Just work it yourself and enjoy the land. If you have a lot of room for crops you might consider holding some of the land in reserve so you can rotate the crops.

I'm all about custom Kydex or anything practical. What I dislike is the twiggy bimbos in daisy Dukes with the boobs hanging out while holding an AR like its an ice cream cone and not eyes/ear protection. This is a semi-biased hobby/activity/sport/industry. We can't become equals if we act like bimbos. I'm all about wearing what makes you comfortable, but I don't take em serious if it's pink and I see panties. The first time hot brass pops down your shirt, is the last time you want that to happen. I've learned the hard way. No more v-necks at the range, no flops. Might not be sexy, but it's safe.

The day I wear a lace corset to carry my gun is the day someone better smack some sense into me. All I really want is for 5.11 to start making sizes larger than a Large so my boobs aren't pancaked down. Or don't make the shoulders so large that a men's looks ridiculous on me. If a woman is more worried about how she looks versus situational awareness, chances are carrying is a waste of her time anyways. With that said, all my Glocks are NiB-X so clearly I do have SOME taste.