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What ever happened to all that "free market" talk?  I guess it only works when you're gouging but not when you get called out on it in front of everyone.  Free market goes both ways.  You can buy up all the supply and make a few bucks, but people absolutely have the right so throw your sorry ass under the bus.

CZ9MM,   What you're missing is that the sellers (or re-sellers to be accurate) are manipulating the supply to drive that equilibrium price up.   Scenario: You and I are the entire buying (demand side) market and we each want some ammo, let's say 2 bricks of .22 each. A store called Wally's represents the entire supply side of the market.   Week 1 - Wally's is happy to sell those to us for $20 each. They know through market research that they can sell them for $25 each, but will sell fewer. They're a low-margin, high-volume store so they set the price at $20. They have one in stock, and should have some more in next week. I get there first, so I buy the brick at $20 and you get none.   Week 2 - I still want another brick and you still want two. You get the brick for $20 'cause you get there first, and we both have a little something to shoot, but we'll have to wait until next week when they expect a larger shipment of 3 bricks to show up to top off our supplies. We'll each plan to get our last brick and there'll be one left for later. Fantastic, right?   Week 3 - When the truck unloads at Wally's a fellow, (we'll call him BBJ) buys all 3 bricks before we can get there leaving the shelf bare. Now BBJ doesn't want to shoot them. For all we know, he doesn't even have a .22 firearm. He tells us in the parking lot that he'll gladly sell us each a box for $50. We say "screw you" and go back to shooting our remaining boolits from our 1st brick.   Week 4 - Wally's gets another couple of bricks in, but whaddayaknow, our old friend BBJ has scooped up both boxes and again offers to sell them for $50 in the parking lot. Now this time, you and I are getting pretty low on our supply and could really use that extra brick, but comeonman! $50? ain't gonna happen so we go home empty handed again.   Week 5 - Wally's doesn't get any on the truck. that's kind of normal for Wally's. Every week doesn't always bring in more .22 because some weeks there's still some sitting around from prior shipments.   Week 6 - 2 bricks arrive and BBJ snakes them both. You and I are both totally out from our 1st bricks. Want to buy some for $50 yet? Sorry...you can't.....this week our buddy BBJ wants $75 a brick.   Week X - Week Y repeat ad nauseum.   So when I finally break down and buy one brick from the asshole, does that mean that $75 is the equilibrium price? Keep in mind that the actual supply to the market from the manufacturer has not changed. Wally's still gets its customary weekly shipment just as it always has.   What about when our neighbor, Mr. Newb, gets a new .22 rifle and needs some ammo for it? This would normally be an honest increase in the demand side. But Mr. Newb heard on the news that maybe the UN, or Obama, or the EPA or Ronald McDonald is going to ban .22 so he goes to get some from Wally's. Finding none for weeks on end, he panics and buys from BBJ. Does that make $75 the new market equilibrium price?   Supply and Demand economics is based on the principle of free flow of product and cash between the maker of a product and a consumer of a product. Prices are bumped up somewhat by a value-added supply chain. Winchester wants to sell 1,000,000 rounds at a time and will sell them for $.03 each and you have to pick them up at their factory. You and I only want to buy 1,000 at a time and can't/won't drive to their factory. Wally's buys the million rounds and resells them in smaller lots closer to us. They add value by doing this for us and we reward them with an extra $.01 per round.   What BBJ is doing is not adding any value. The lot size, location, and product are exactly the same as how Wally's delivered them. Winchester still got their $.03 per round and Wally's made their $.01 per round. BBJ is manipulating the supply by monopolizing it as best he can. He's also manipulating the demand by starving the market of its usual supply to increase the feeling of panic amongst the consumers. That is NOT free-market enterprise. It's price-fixing market-manipulation at its worst.

  Ass implants.

He says all the right things.  However, I don't trust him for one damn minute, and Obama has proven himself to be a total dumbass, so in essence, we, the American people, are ****ed.

  Exactly.  When I decided to get out of .45 I sold and/or traded both of my .45 pistols and all of my ammo here via TGO.  The jerks who show up at Academy and Walmart for every shipment and clean them out of .22 just so they can stick it up online for inflated prices ... those are the guys I want to kick square in the nuts.

Well I haven't been buying any at all. I won't contribute to the nonsense other than buying ammo from a dealer when it's available. I'd rather not shoot than line the pockets of some POS trying to profit from market panic.

  Red highlighted emphasis is mine.  THAT is the key difference.  You've sold what you already had, for whatever reason.  Be it you changed calibers, got rid of a gun entirely, whatever... it was yours already and you had no need for it.   The people I take issue with are the ones who clean out entire ammo supplies at stores to capitalize on "market panic".  They buy it from Wal-Mart or some other retailer and then dole it back out to people for a premium price because those people feel hostage to the situation.  It's morally and ethically wrong.  Benton offered up the sort of gouging that happened in Nashville during the flood a few years back as evidence that he's not guilty of gouging.  I say hogwash.  It's the same damn thing.   When a buying public feels that they have no alternative but pay an artificially inflated price for an item that the seller either partially or wholly controls the supply of, through nefarious means, then that seller is guilty of gouging.   I'm seriously teetering on the edge of actually wanting more government involvement in ammo sales as a result of this crap.

  Same at my local Walmart.   I have been trying to get with the manager to offer to him a stamp the says "Originally sold at Walmart". This would hopefully keep some people from buying it. Or a stamp that says "Not for resale". While it is unenforceable legally it would raise enough suspicions to keep them from being resold.   In 2008 Bass Pro had some guys who would block the isles while their buddies would load up carts on shipment days. If you tried to get by those blocking the ends of the isle they would start screaming about how they were being assaulted. They would scream they were calling the cops and such. It was such a circus that most people didn't want to take a chance on getting by. I talked to a salesperson and asked if the manager knew. They said the manager did and didn;t care because the ammo was being sold. That was probably the last time I bought ammo, or anything other than a soda and beef jerky, from the store. I will not support a store that supports that kind of antics. I didn't even go back and use my points.   I met a dealer who was buying all the ammo when bricks were $12. I asked if I could get a brick and he said sure, $20. He wanted me to give him $20 then he would hand me a brick and I would have to pay for the brick. I laughed and he said if I decided I wanted to buy some come to XXX gunshop but it would be $37. That was his mistake. After that I blasted the story on every single board I could find. I told all my shooting friends and they spread the word. Six months after this he shut his doors when every other dealer was doing well.   Like you said, they have every right to ask whatever they want but I have every right to blast them if I am not happy about it.

  No it isn't. It's just a ploy, Putin gives a crap about "the right thing".   It's just a chess game to keep his port, air space, and landing fields there.   And the chess game has lots of moves, will be a long drawn out affair at best, and will likely never remove all the chem WMDs from circulation.   - OS

Here is a link to an article about a lady who moved from Virginia to Wyoming and when she found out about some pending legislation concerning relaxing some gun laws, wrote a representative about her concerns. His advice to her: Leave!   http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/02/24/by-all-means-leave-the-amazingly-blunt-response-one-state-rep-gave-a-citizen-who-wrote-him-opposing-concealed-carry-in-schools/

  Ask me how many times I've gone shooting in the past 10 months.  It's embarrassing!  I haven't shot a single round because I don't want to burn up ammo I can't easily replace.  :(

I find that I no longer need to buy mayonnaise by the gallon.

To the post above, I don't think selling some spare ammo you have that you don't really need for a reasonable price is gouging.  I think when you make it a "business" to buy anything you can and try to sell it for considerably higher prices than normal market value, then yes you are moving into the gouging arena.  I consider normal market value to be Walmart prices or slightly higher, but not 75 -100% higher.  I think for most, it's not just the high prices that get people worked up, it's the concerted effort to take advantage of people and then make excuses as to why it is ok.

What do I think? Can we hire this guy?

Putin makes more sense than Obama. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

Sales tax only has to be paid once.  So long as you're paying tax when you buy this stuff to turn around and sell it again, you should not collect sales tax from the person buying it from you.   Sooner or later the BATFE is going to get involved in this practice and the rest of us are going to suffer as a result of it.  Currently buying a firearm to flip a firearm is illegal.  It's only a matter of time that they make it the same for ammo, and likely because of opportunistic weasels who are cleaning out retailers to sell it again at a mark-up.   Honestly, I think what you're doing is beyond unscrupulous.  People like you make it hard for others to buy ammo at realistic, fair-market prices, for the sake of protecting themselves or training regularly to be better at it.  You're not buying and selling a commodity, you're buying and selling a means of self defense at a marked-up price because you happen to be able to haunt the retail locations and clean them out while other people are attending to other things.  In this case I am torn between not wanting the government any more involved in Second Amendment issues than they already are, and wanting to see them clean your clock.   The road to hell is certainly paved with nickels and dimes.

  No one cares.  Worry about your own affairs.  What he does with things he bought and paid for are his business, not yours.   I'm giving you 5-days of not being able to post to think on it some.  Attacking your fellow members won't be tolerated here.

I don't know if this is an act of repentance or not, but it seems Bob Corker has finally realized he's hitched his wagon to a dimming star.  Although he still believes Obama is "very good in an interpersonal setting," the junior senator from Tennessee expresses disappointment over how his hero has handled the Syrian issue as commander-in-chief.  Yes, senator....I feel the same way about you as a voice for us.   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxxFk8UwhYM#t=97

Because Obama! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-sdO6pwVHQ

NBC's Richard Engel speaks to Abu Abdul Rahman, a Tunisian man who dropped out of college to fight with al Qaeda in Syria. ANOTHER NEWS STORY: U.S. weapons reaching Syrian rebels The CIA has begun delivering weapons to rebels in Syria, ending months of delay in lethal aid that had been promised by the Obama administration, according to U.S. officials and Syrian figures. If this crap ain't just plain STUPID......PLEASE tell me what is? We are now supplying weapons and advanced communications equipment with an enemy that has sworn to destroy us? I stand corrected. Our leaders are way past stupid.

Ditto Nightrunner. I've gotten lucky a time or two in the afternoon, but rarely. Thankfully I have a stack of .22 bricks pretty tall, deep, and wide... and no, not from panic buying. For about 3 years I was in the habit of buying 2 Federal 550rd bricks every time I was at Wal Mart. Some times that was only once every 2 or 3 months, and other times once a week. It all added up to a "healthy" supply of .22, aling withe the other calibers I shoot. I've been tempted to take advantage of the hysteria and make a small fortune, but I'm such a hoarder I can't bear to let any go! I'm even kicking myself now for selling (at cost) a few boxes to a friend who has had a hard time finding a few calibers. I come by it honestly... you should see al the crap my Mom has been holding on to for 40 years!!

It's funny how we reason about the situation. Most of us can't find ammo to buy (at a normal price) yet we have ammo sitting at home, yet we won't shoot it because we don't know when we can get any more.   Unfortunately the real victims of this whole ammo shortage/gouging mess are the shooting sports in general. Ask any club or range, and they'll tell you activity/participation is at an all time low.   What we really all should be doing is continue shooting at our normal pace, slowly depleting our 'stash'. At the same time we're doing that and enjoying our shooting sessions again... do not buy replacement ammo until it sits in stacks on Walmart shelves again. No demand, the gougers will quit.   No doubt, I'm the odd duck on this and that's ok, but I have not slowed my pace to shoot. Yes I reload, and yes I have a reasonable supply of ammo and components. No, I have no bought a box of rimfire ammo since it got crazy and no I don't have 10-20 thousand rounds of .22 either. I do have about six bricks and shoot it whenever I feel like it. It takes a lot longer to shoot it up than you think. But every day the sun comes up, I'm going to enjoy life and if that includes going to the range to burn some rounds, I'm going to do it. I think many of us get into this hoarding thing without really being sensible about it. Does anyone really think ammo is going away? Do you really need a gazillion rounds for the end of the world? I don't, and life is happier with that attitude.   When I shoot my last round, then I may stand in line for some more...but not until! I shot at the range yesterday and I'm going again this Saturday. I suggest you all do the same and let the gougers choke on what's stacked in their house...which is something I wouldn't want in the first place. Too much ammo, is prone to bad things like theft and house fires...both of which your insurance company will not cover adequately. Check your contents policy if you don't believe me.   This HAS been an interesting thread! :popcorn:   Good day!

I have had both and now just have Costco.  The Nashville Costcos are not posted.  I was in the Cool Springs location today carrying.     Costco seems to have a little better quality merchandise than Sams.  Their store brand, Kirklands, is a good brand.  I have bought a lot of Kirlands merch from batteries to trash bags to food and its all been good quality.   To me, the difference between Sams and Costco is like the difference between Wal MArt and Target.  They both have the same basic stuff but Target is nicer.

  And they would be buying it at a normal price from a regular retailer that is a normal part of the supply/demand chain rather than paying overinflated prices to profiteers who are interrupting the normal supply/demand chain and contributing to a perceived shortage, thereby creating a FALSE market, not a free market.   As others have said, a person who decides to sell something they have decided that don't need, cannot use, etc. is not the same.  A person or business that obtains goods from a regular supplier and sells to the public at a normal, retail price is not the same.  A person who makes a product and sells it to the public is not the same.  A person who knowingly and willfully buys a high demand item from a retailer - and uses straw man purchases (i.e. brings his buddies with him) to skirt rules put in place by said retailer to try and prevent exactly what that person is doing - is not 'just another entrepreneur participating in the free market economy.'  Instead, such a person is a profiteer who is falsely manipulating the market to be able to sell at ridiculous prices.

I am so proud too be a part of this historic thread :usa:

[quote name="vontar" post="1031172" timestamp="1378955470"] Thing is, Russia is actually trying (at least in public eye) to do the right thing. Talk with Syria government and get them to turn over weapons and allow UN inspections. What Obamma should have done instead of going out and making speeches and trying to get support to pull the trigger was, should have talked with Russia since Russia and Syria are allies and got Russia and USA to jointly have talks with Syria jointly. This time, I think the American people saw Obamma as a warmonger.[/quote] Make no mistake, while Putin says "the right things" he in no way cares or is trying to do "the right thing." This is all a matter of self interest and opportunity. Not that I disagree with most of what he says, I just know he's not saying it for the right reasons. At any rate, Putin is playing chess while Obama is playing checkers. At this point, however, there is not a damn thing the administration can do to look better or save face other than admitting that it ain't our business and we're leaving it to the Syrian people and the international community. Obama and Kerry painted themselves into a corner, so all of this nonsense is of their design.

  Oh, the games have already begun on his end. Putin has already nixed first UN Security Council draft mentioning force if Assad doesn't meet whatever deadline proposed.   This will turn into an Irani type nuclear materials bait and switch on the chemical weapons stuff regarding letting UN in to find them and etc. And how you'd do that in the middle of a muddled civil war, depending on Assad's army to provide protection, is beyond me.   One analyst was talking today, saying that IF you actually had all the chemical weapons that Assad is projected to have corralled into one place, it would still take at least two years to safely incinerate them.   So I expect this will just turn into a long term back and forth, and if no more chemical attacks happen, will just assume back burner status, and eventually drop off the mainstream radar all together.   - OS

About half of the USA and most of the rest of the world has seen right through Obama's lies and failure as president. Too bad so many voters in America has turned into a bunch of takers. They would rather trade responsibility and freedom for free cell phones and free cheese.

another kick in the nuts to Das Leader.   Not that I trust Vlad either.

I wish I could like this 10k times. Tapatalk ate my spelling.

I'm getting ready to post the new order thread. Just trying to square awry the details.

+1...Busting a gut to shoot off some munitions in Syria but could not save American lives in Benghazi when no constitutional requirement to get Congressional approval existed. Assets within distance to make a difference. Nope. Did not watch it. No way to know what the truth is anyway. However I do believe that both sides of the Syrian civil war are not our friends. I say "stay out of Syria". No upside for us. All my elected officials know how I feel but doubt if that means anything.

Stages are up at facebook/ORSA-uspsa for "The Bocephus Blast."  Weather is going to be great, come join the fun.  The Date is 21 September - Setup is Thursday evening, Sept 19, starting at 5 PM.

http://www.gunssavelife.com/?p=9194 "Illinois prohibition on carrying firearms outside the home was struck down today by the Illinois State Supreme Court in 9-0 decision People v. Aguilar. As far as we know, this is the first time a state supreme court in the United States has ruled the right to keep and bear arms applies outside the four corners of a residence." More at link.

If you get K baffles it will be the best for use with subsonic ammo. My Form 1 can is all K baffles and it is pretty quiet. It gets even quieter when I add coolant.   Ammo makes a huge difference too. Supersonic, bulk ammo is the worst as far as port noise. Even if the bullets are not supersonic all the extra pressure coming out of the port makes for a very loud gun. Subsonic ammo is a lot quieter. The suppressor increases the pressures too and that only increases the port noise.   The quietest and most accurate ammo I have shot has been the Winchester Subsonic Hollow Point. It is even quieter that CCI Subsonic.

I was in the Knoxville Costco about a month ago and I saw no postings. Used to belong to Sam's but Costco is closer. Costco's 1/4 lb. polish hotdog and soda w/free refills for $1.50 calls me in occasionally. Have gotten some great deals on Kirkland (Duracell at the time) batteries.

  Though I "liked" your post, I'm afraid I don't think it's enough to "wake" enough of the overall electorate to reroute the liberal roller coaster for the presidency. I still believe only truly Bad Times that disrupt the Uncle Sugar Train will change it.   As usual, this whole Syrian saga is only on the radar of maybe 1 or 2  in 10 folks who vote in the American Idol race every 4 years.   - OS

Costco doesn't like my gun being in their store so this one is a no brainer for me.

Based on what I can tell from talking to the sporting goods folks at the various Walmarts in my area, there are around 6 guys who are buying up all the stock of .22. Same ones each shipment and they will have buddies buy as well and give them a cut of the profits to get around the 3 box limit. This is the example of the kind of scalping that should earn people a beating. That same ammo is sold for three times or more what the actual retail cost is, so the only hope is to buy online if you want .22 at a decent price, however, now you're in the national competition with all the scalpers out there. At least hoarders have a good reason. Scalpers are just trying to make a buck off their fellow man by keeping the panic going. I hope more scalpers are called out and mentally recorded.

Unfortunately i have a real job to be at when shipments come in.

I've been echoing the Representatives' words for several years. People move to Tenn. after they've effectively F-ed up their own states and then start voting to F-up this one. WY has long been on my list of states that I would move to because of the minimal number of laws, and the fact that they are less invasive of individual rights.

For me I don't find the beauty in the diamonds, gold or pearls. I find it in the mechical abilities of old world craftsmen. Remember this was when the world had never heard of a calculator, digital micrometers or most machines. I find it fascinating in that I cannot visualize how it works.   In the same way RED333 finds mini V8 fascinating, which I do too, I find these fascinating. Not because of their outward beauty but because of their complexity.

Bourbon, dark beer and cigars.  Those things soothe the inner beast.  

  It was a conversation.  The gangrape came in when the OP dropped the soap on aisle 9 in the sporting goods department at Wal-Mart.

And a time limit would allow that. Not sure if it is possible but I am a member of another board that you can edit the posts for about 10 minutes then it is locked in place.   I think it would also have a secondary effect of forcing people to standa by what they post. People post something then decide to change it. If it was worth posting in the first place it should not be edited or deleted later.

Are some just assuming they know who the Armslist seller is? I didn't see any personal information in the ads.

Thanks, whitewolf. lol

I've said it once and I'll say it again. Oh wait, I meant...

:rofl: :rofl: You actually got blocked from a thread? I didn't even know we could do that! From now on I'm blocking EVERYONE from all my threads, that way no one can publicly disagree with me which means I am by default always right. ;)

Here is mine: I bought it a couple weeks ago off Gunbroker. It's not a typical Glock, it's their Professional Line, noted as "GL23PL, or PL23 for short. It's now my daily carry. I like it because with the included holster, you are guaranteed not to shoot yourself if it discharges negligently because of where it is pointed when holstered. And trust me, it discharges negligently a lot. It's worth it though because not only do these discharges replace my CW badge (because I no longer have to display that I have a gun when everyone can just hear rounds popping off in the distance while I am walking), but it also looks different too when I have to toss it to the ground shortly before being tackled to the pavement by the LEO's I now know by name. Top of its class though. Top of its class!