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So the wife and I went to Cool Springs mall to do some Christmas shopping (actually she did and just took me along), I was planted our in the foyer when some wannabe thugs/punks were walking around the top throwing change at people down below (terrible aim too, they missed everyone). I spotted one before he disappeared into the crowd, and performed handicapped ninja moves to get up the escalator and track them down.   They had went over to another section above the Apple store, getting ready to start throwing things again so I put on my old crazy guy face, pulled out a dollar bill and sat next to them on the bench rubbing against them (mind you there was plenty of empty space and other places to sit, I just wanted to make them uncomfortable). Looked at one of them and asked if they had change for a dollar, scooted a little closer and asked louder. One of them got puffy and another guy said no, and I said "that's a shame, cause I can't afford to throw dollars over the balcony, I prefer to use nickels instead"    All three of them took off & me being the ass that I am, I spent another 10 minutes following them staring, and making sure they seen me. They went over to the food court and I disappeared for a few minutes, went around the back way, snuck up behind them and sat down at the table and asked "You got change for a dollar?"  It creeped them out so bad they left their drinks on the table and bolted for the door   Should've probably just called security on them, but it wouldn't have been as fun  :rofl:

  It seems to me that these deranged mass murderers usually search for a "soft target". You don't hear of this happening at an NWTF banquet, gun show, police department, etc. The last so many have happened at places labeled "Gun Free Zones". Stick a gunbuster sign in your front yard and see how it works out for ya.   This, however, isn't the root of the problem. I see the direct correlation between this country turning it's back on God, and the degredation of our society.

You're pretty smart for a meat eater :). We can blame the gun, morals, lack of accessible mental health care, etc. Fact is, if somebody would have capped his ass, the killing would have stopped immediately. We need to protect our kids like we protect our money. It's a nasty world.

So are we blaming video games now? Why not guns too? Can't we just stick to blaming the POS for committing an awful, incomprehensible act?

I only saw a bit on the news of obama.  He appeared genuine to me.  I don't know how a parent could speak about it and not be somewhat emotional.  I know I could not wait to get home last night and hug my grandkids a little bit.  One a five year old in kindergarten.  I am pretty sure my eyes watered even if I did not have to wipe the tears away.   He is damned no matter what on this.  If talks about it he is making politcal hay, if he had ignored it he would be criticized for that.   A push for gun control is coming, this event does not effect that.  It was going to happen anyway.

Like him or not, our president is the father of two children, and a human being. I expect he was shaken by this senseless tragedy just as all of us were. I'm a fairly cold, heartless SOB, and it hits me hard. I also imagine, that as the leader of the country, he feels the need to do something. I don't know exactly what that will be, but I ain't looking forward to it.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=348_1355575996         That was about the last thing I thought was going to happen  :rofl:

No OB doc in his right mind would give you permission in writing.  If the baby is not 'perfect' any lawyer would have a cake walk taking him to the cleaners.  While no range is going to tell you there are problems, all have some airborne lead.  I would not risk my unborn child's hearing or health.  If something showed up later on, you would certainly have some 'what ifs".

Mass killings have been going on since man strapped a rock to a stick. Charles Whitman lead a pretty sheltered childhood, in a time before violent shows and video games. He was raised in a strict Roman Catholic house if I remember correctly. There was no shortage of structure, discipline or God. He still managed to kill nearly as many people in a mass shooting, and would have likely killed many more if he was able. This idea that this behavior is new is silly. This has gone on since the dawn of time. The difference is there more people now and 24/7 news. The sky isn't falling. This is, sadly, business as usual.

These stories are always nice to hear, especially this time of year.

Don't worry Dolomite, Ill stay on top of the other postions we discussed. Cz ive had on and offs a year, but this was the longest, and the shop I was working in went belly up back in Oct. I spent everyday filling out applacations, dropping off resumes, and doing anything from splitting wood to working on cars off craigslist to make ends meet. The jobs are there, and I refuse to get on welfare and goverment cheese when I'm a young able bodied man capable of work. Its just not how I was raised.

Ya'll need to lighten up on the conspiracy theory shit.  Simple fact is this country is full of retards prone to violence.

Tin foil me silver but I would not be surprised to discover that things were.......orchestrated.

When the facts come out let me know.  I'm tired of playing the what happened when game get again.   There is so much bullshit flooding the newswaves right now I don't think anyone has a clear picture of what happend and how.

  He should have never said the words "Second Amendment."   Taking guns from the "wrong people" is fine, but so emphatically calling the Second Amendment by name is an attack on it.  The key word of your post was "yet." 

  I recall another term for it growing up in Midtown that would shock most folks these days, even here.   :lol:

He probably saved a lot of lives with his actions. What is it with these pieces DooDoo taking their own lives? Are they that Chicken S***? Real men....   Dave S

This is the best analysis I've read on the situation so far, made by Morgan Freeman of all people:         CNN’s article says that if the body count “holds up”, this will rank as the second deadliest shooting behind Virginia Tech, as if statistics somehow make one shooting worse than another. Then they post a video interview of third-graders for all the details of what they saw and heard while the shootings were happening. Fox News has plastered the killer’s face on all their reports for hours. Any articles or news stories yet that focus on the victims and ignore the killer’s identity? None that I've seen yet. Because they don’t sell. So congratulations, sensationalist media, you've just lit the fire for someone to top this and knock off a day care center or a maternity ward next. You can help by forgetting you ever read this man's name, and remembering the name of at least one victim. You can help by donating to mental health research instead of pointing to gun control as the problem. You can help by turning off the news."    

new barrel = good groups: :pleased: (1.74 inches, 5 shots @ 25 yards)

I despise the man but I felt he was being sincere during the press conference.      And I fully expect him to push for some form of gun control.

Online petitions are worthless. 

I believe that the root of the problem is that we have failed to teach our children that human life is sacred and we are now reaping what we have sown.

Hey big man lemme hold a dollar!

Personally, I think it's a combination of a lot of things and I think they all have a common root. We have devalued personal responsibility: physically, emotionally, spiritually, and morally and this is what we get. The idea that humanity has evolved past it's base humanist, arrogant, and selfish nature is foolish. Technology has changed how we mask and/or display that nature, but human nature has not nor will it change. That is what we need to address not the tools employed.   That being said I'm more than a little bothered that the first vocalized emotions to much of this is political and/or societal hedging. Gun control, pharmaceuticals, government, education, etc. have a time and place to be discussed.  I don't think this is the time.

I watched it ........ the whole thing. I'm not trying to downplay the situation by any means but not only the way he wiped the "tears" seemed odd, I told my wife during the live broadcast that it seemed very strange that he was reading every single word (word for word) from notes and was constantly staring at the paperwork. I know he normally uses a telle-prompter - but this was different. It would seem that if you were truly speaking to the nation and it was coming from the heart, which this situation should surely deserve, you would do just that - face the camera and speak from inside your soul - not read a pre-written series of lines. I also thought it seemed that he was reading something that someone else had written because of the way that he stumbled with each line of the message. Hmmmm ......... truly a "heart felt" moment there Mr. President. I'm sorry, but the families of the victims and the people of this country deserve better - much, much better! This was not the place nor time for swinging into your gun ban agenda. I am truly sickened and saddened by this event - but at the same time, this President continues to infuriate me!

I found this old knife, covered in rust, in the bottom of a toolbox that has set undisturbed for at least 10 years, possibly longer. A few hours and a lot of elbow grease later, a knife emerged. I believe this to have belonged to my wife's grandfather. I am going to give it to my son, a knife that was his great grandfathers. The antique look of it makes it one of a kind. I am not sure what type of steel it is, but I do know the guard is brass. I hope my son keeps this and passes it on...

  Well; he said: [quote]Now we are under despotic rule and the only way out will be through mass use of force[/quote] Substitute any word  for "preaching" that you feel is more appropriate but to me, his words sound like a desire for it; not just an observation.   If we have done ALL that we can to peacefully turn our nation around (and losing a couple of elections hardly constitutes "all") and then we fail or if jack-booted thugs come to take away what freedoms we have left and/or simply start shooting then armed resistance is all that is left but I've no desire for such bloodshed nor will I support anyone who does desire it.

  I wonder how many folks' last thought when confronted by a mass shooter was "I sure wish I had a gun".   - OS

  Yeah, constant echo in here.   The actual quote, for anyone unfamiliar:   "There's no way to rule innocent men. The only power government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren't enough criminals, one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws."    - Dr. Floyd Ferris in Ayn Rand's Atlas Shrugged  

Ever heard of J. Edgar Hoover?  This is nothing new.

If you've come here to preach armed rebellion I certainly do hope you are in the minority.   You may be "libertarian" but where you are heading is anarchy; that's a trip I won't take with you.

Remember regulations and executive orders are subject to judicial review if they are challenged in court.  The federal court and the supremes have already ruled on this one.  The gun grabbers lost.   leroy

As sad as this one is; it is goin to be a redux of the Jared Laughtner thing regarding the "gun control" issue with a couple of important differences.  Laughtner (...like this kid, apparently...) wuz a nut.  Laughtner bought his gun(s) lawfully and his nutty tendencies were protected by the universities.  He went out and shot and killed several folks.     This 20 year old apparently murdered his mom and stole the guns from her house (...if i wuz reading right...).  This 20 year old nut did a heinous, unthinkable, nutty thing by murdering children and a few adults.  He broke the law; as to both firearms and murder.  No amount of law would have fixed this one.  It is the heinous, nutty act of a mad man.  The real criminals (...outside of this 20 year old...) are the folks who may have coddled and sheltered his tendencies; overlookin the potential for this type crime.    Once the adults start lookin at this one, i predict they will shut up and quit talkin about it because all of what they want in firearms restrictions are in place in the peoples democratic republics of CT and NJ; and some smart guy will bring that up.  There is also that pesky thing (...to them, at least...) called the Second Amendment.  I predict that the usual "we need to tighten up gunlaws" platitudinous baloney will be spoken by the usual jackasses like Bloomberg and others.  Dingy Harry will ignore it in the senate and so will Bohener in the house.   leroy

It's the same 25 yards.  Same batch of ammo.  More than half the size in groups!  (that's 5 shoots there, it's hard to see the 5th hole but it's essentially went into the same hole on the bottom).   The other groups were still 3-4 inches but 4.3 grains of bullsey seem to get it right on.   Here is the rest of the story:   That little dot target was blurry as heck!  and I had this HUGE headache by the time I was shooting the 3rd group.   I just concentrated and still managed to pull this one off.  When I got home I realized that I put my contacts in wrong!  (left to right and right to left).  I'm going to go back to the range with the same 4.3 loaded ammo But this time with good eyes and then I'll see what it can really do!   I'm a happy camper!

Preachin' to the choir.

I saw it, and thought it was genuine too. With that said, now he's off to apply the wrong solutions, and a lot of them. My deep dislike for the guy lies in his incompetence.

  We also need to stop ignoring what effect violent games, violent cartoons, & shows kids watch today. I don't have cable or satellite at my house and I control what my two young boys watch & what games they play. While visting a friends house I was shocked at some of the gorey, violent movies they let their kids watch and the games they play all day. These are young kids, not teenagers. Their kids are absolute hellians too! You can't tell me there's not a connection to the way these kids act & what their parents let them watch and play. Using TV and video games as baby sitting devices only supports the behavior. Notice a pattern when people always say it's the quiet ones? That's because often they're the kids that get ignored by parents and picked on at school & hold it in until they snap. People & kids are becoming desensitized to violence & cruelty because they see it all day every day and it has an effect on them. It should be no surprise that some of them loose a sense of reality & pull a stunt like this.

  I'm not a very religious person but I completely agree with this. We were a better society when everyone went to church and had strong Christian values.   Times are a changing.

  I'm sorry but I disagree...  The root of the problem is we as a society create gun free zones...  and smart people who should know better continue to place themselves and their loved ones in these gun free zones...  Which seem to be the only place where evil nutters like this one show up and start shooting people.   Israel had a terrible attack on their schools in 1974 called the Ma'alot massacre, after that they made it policy to arm all of their teachers at all times...  There is a picture of a school teacher with an M1 carbine on page 3 of this thread.  That was a very successful choice, because no schools were successfully attacked in Israel until March of 2008...  when a school was attacked and 8 people lost their lives.   In that attack, the terrorist had a fully automatic AKM with between 500 and 600 rounds of ammo.  He was stopped in minutes by a part time student (who was allowed to be armed) and a Captain in the IDF.  If it had not been for a part time student the death toll would have been much greater, Yitzhak Dadon was a hero that day.   The problem is not allowing otherwise law abiding citizens from being armed, and in the case of teachers giving them the responsibility and capability to protect those in their charge.

I don't see a problem with people questioning what they see .......... and I'm proud to be a member here and other forums where people voice their opinions and we all get a chance to agree, argue or debate - in a mostly civilized manner.   What should shame you is the current leadership of this country!

Makes me proud to know you Spots! Good things come to good people...never forget that!   Dave S

I do not trust anything about the God-Emperor Barack Hussein Obama.   He and his staff have already made it abundantly clear that they will "Not Let a Crisis Go to Waste."   A mentally ill 20-year-old kills his divorced mother in a rage, steals her guns and her car, and drives to her school to massacre all her kindergarten students.   There is a long litany of gun control laws on the books that make this highly illegal in addition to extremely tragic, with flags and warnings and sign-posts along the way calling out the extreme danger building.   Clearly a crisis that cannot go to waste. Enter stage left, the God-Emperor Barack Hussein Obama and his Court Jester, Bloomberg the Ludicrous, Mayor of New York; Dancer Emanuel, Mayor of Chicago; and all their silly minions and sycophants.

I had a neighbor that would always let his dog piss on my mailbox plant every morning , after replacing the plant 3 times and asking him to stop I placed very fine broken glass around it ; it stopped.

  Dunno what they restrictions CT has, but hicap mags for pistols or rifles aren't among them.   edit: they're saying now that all the weapons were legally "registered" to the guy's mom. Obviously, a person commandeering another's legal weapon isn't going to be prevented by existing laws, or even by more stringent ones.   Even if you make not securing firearms a crime (which it might already be in CT for all I know, it is some states), punishing the person who let it happen still does not absolutely prevent it.   - OS

Auntie Em!! Auntie Em!!

Quite simply, I'm not a doctor and even if I was I probably couldn't tell you definitively one way or the other if being on a range for an extended period whilst pregnant is harmful to your unborn child. I do know that I wouldn't take that risk. Between the noise and the lead exposure, sorry, not worth the risk. Many things can affect the development of a fetus. I don't think there is enough information out there to say that limited exposure on a range is dangerous, but just because there haven't been studies doesn't mean the risk isn't there. I wouldn't do it. Just wait 'til the baby is born.

Sig P220 Carry,8+1,SAO,NS,Rosewood.......imma kid in a candy store with this gem carries really well and ill be at the range this weekend running it through its paces [IMG]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v328/excelerater/ASST%20GUNS/P220.jpg[/IMG]

Just make sure they aren't 17 year old thug wan-a-bes out for skittles and a soda.

If you ever see some type of bag on fire outside the door after these shenanigans DO NOT stomp on it.

I'd like to change mine. You know which three.