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I have to say, with absolute honesty, that if you shot my dog I'm not sure the police would get there in time to help you. For some reason this story just makes me seethe with anger. Dogs are probably the one living example of God's unconditional love for us. No matter how bad things may be going for you, a dog is the one animal on this earth who is likely to love you more than you love yourself. This bitter, hateful, evil old man is a ticking time bomb. Give him a few years and he'll be pulling a gun on someone's [b]CHILD[/b] who wanders into his yard. Piece of human s***t.

Speech by Ron Paul. Fantastic. While I don't agree with every position he takes, I do agree on the principles he advocates 100%. Please share http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q03cWio-zjk&feature=youtube_gdata_player This may well be the last time I speak on the House Floor. At the end of the year I’ll leave Congress after 23 years in office over a 36 year period. My goals in 1976 were the same as they are today: promote peace and prosperity by a strict adherence to the principles of individual liberty. It was my opinion, that the course the U.S. embarked on in the latter part of the 20th Century would bring us a major financial crisis and engulf us in a foreign policy that would overextend us and undermine our national security. To achieve the goals I sought, government would have had to shrink in size and scope, reduce spending, change the monetary system, and reject the unsustainable costs of policing the world and expanding the American Empire. The problems seemed to be overwhelming and impossible to solve, yet from my view point, just following the constraints placed on the federal government by the Constitution would have been a good place to start. In many ways, according to conventional wisdom, my off-and-on career in Congress, from 1976 to 2012, accomplished very little. No named legislation, no named federal buildings or highways—thank goodness. In spite of my efforts, the government has grown exponentially, taxes remain excessive, and the prolific increase of incomprehensible regulations continues. Wars are constant and pursued without Congressional declaration, deficits rise to the sky, poverty is rampant and dependency on the federal government is now worse than any time in our history. All this with minimal concerns for the deficits and unfunded liabilities that common sense tells us cannot go on much longer. A grand, but never mentioned, bipartisan agreement allows for the well-kept secret that keeps the spending going. One side doesn’t give up one penny on military spending, the other side doesn’t give up one penny on welfare spending, while both sides support the bailouts and subsidies for the banking and corporate elite. And the spending continues as the economy weakens and the downward spiral continues. As the government continues fiddling around, our liberties and our wealth burn in the flames of a foreign policy that makes us less safe. The major stumbling block to real change in Washington is the total resistance to admitting that the country is broke. This has made compromising, just to agree to increase spending, inevitable since neither side has any intention of cutting spending. The country and the Congress will remain divisive since there’s no “loot left to divvy up.” Without this recognition the spenders in Washington will continue the march toward a fiscal cliff much bigger than the one anticipated this coming January. I have thought a lot about why those of us who believe in liberty, as a solution, have done so poorly in convincing others of its benefits. If liberty is what we claim it is- the principle that protects all personal, social and economic decisions necessary for maximum prosperity and the best chance for peace- it should be an easy sell. Yet, history has shown that the masses have been quite receptive to the promises of authoritarians which are rarely if ever fulfilled. If authoritarianism leads to poverty and war and less freedom for all individuals and is controlled by rich special interests, the people should be begging for liberty. There certainly was a strong enough sentiment for more freedom at the time of our founding that motivated those who were willing to fight in the revolution against the powerful British government. During my time in Congress the appetite for liberty has been quite weak; the understanding of its significance negligible. Yet the good news is that compared to 1976 when I first came to Congress, the desire for more freedom and less government in 2012 is much greater and growing, especially in grassroots America. Tens of thousands of teenagers and college age students are, with great enthusiasm, welcoming the message of liberty. I have a few thoughts as to why the people of a country like ours, once the freest and most prosperous, allowed the conditions to deteriorate to the degree that they have. Freedom, private property, and enforceable voluntary contracts, generate wealth. In our early history we were very much aware of this. But in the early part of the 20th century our politicians promoted the notion that the tax and monetary systems had to change if we were to involve ourselves in excessive domestic and military spending. That is why Congress gave us the Federal Reserve and the income tax. The majority of Americans and many government officials agreed that sacrificing some liberty was necessary to carry out what some claimed to be “progressive” ideas. Pure democracy became acceptable. They failed to recognized that what they were doing was exactly opposite of what the colonists were seeking when they broke away from the British. Some complain that my arguments makes no sense, since great wealth and the standard of living improved for many Americans over the last 100 years, even with these new policies. But the damage to the market economy, and the currency, has been insidious and steady. It took a long time to consume our wealth, destroy the currency and undermine productivity and get our financial obligations to a point of no return. Confidence sometimes lasts longer than deserved. Most of our wealth today depends on debt. The wealth that we enjoyed and seemed to be endless, allowed concern for the principle of a free society to be neglected. As long as most people believed the material abundance would last forever, worrying about protecting a competitive productive economy and individual liberty seemed unnecessary. This neglect ushered in an age of redistribution of wealth by government kowtowing to any and all special interests, except for those who just wanted to left alone. That is why today money in politics far surpasses money currently going into research and development and productive entrepreneurial efforts. The material benefits became more important than the understanding and promoting the principles of liberty and a free market. It is good that material abundance is a result of liberty but if materialism is all that we care about, problems are guaranteed. The crisis arrived because the illusion that wealth and prosperity would last forever has ended. Since it was based on debt and a pretense that debt can be papered over by an out-of-control fiat monetary system, it was doomed to fail. We have ended up with a system that doesn’t produce enough even to finance the debt and no fundamental understanding of why a free society is crucial to reversing these trends. If this is not recognized, the recovery will linger for a long time. Bigger government, more spending, more debt, more poverty for the middle class, and a more intense scramble by the elite special interests will continue. Without an intellectual awakening, the turning point will be driven by economic law. A dollar crisis will bring the current out-of-control system to its knees. If it’s not accepted that big government, fiat money, ignoring liberty, central economic planning, welfarism, and warfarism caused our crisis we can expect a continuous and dangerous march toward corporatism and even fascism with even more loss of our liberties. Prosperity for a large middle class though will become an abstract dream. This continuous move is no different than what we have seen in how our financial crisis of 2008 was handled. Congress first directed, with bipartisan support, bailouts for the wealthy. Then it was the Federal Reserve with its endless quantitative easing. If at first it doesn’t succeed try again; QE1, QE2, and QE3 and with no results we try QE indefinitely—that is until it too fails. There’s a cost to all of this and let me assure you delaying the payment is no longer an option. The rules of the market will extract its pound of flesh and it won’t be pretty. The current crisis elicits a lot of pessimism. And the pessimism adds to less confidence in the future. The two feed on themselves, making our situation worse. If the underlying cause of the crisis is not understood we cannot solve our problems. The issues of warfare, welfare, deficits, inflationism, corporatism, bailouts and authoritarianism cannot be ignored. By only expanding these policies we cannot expect good results. Everyone claims support for freedom. But too often it’s for one’s own freedom and not for others. Too many believe that there must be limits on freedom. They argue that freedom must be directed and managed to achieve fairness and equality thus making it acceptable to curtail, through force, certain liberties. Some decide what and whose freedoms are to be limited. These are the politicians whose goal in life is power. Their success depends on gaining support from special interests. The great news is the answer is not to be found in more “isms.” The answers are to be found in more liberty which cost so much less. Under these circumstances spending goes down, wealth production goes up, and the quality of life improves. Just this recognition—especially if we move in this direction—increases optimism which in itself is beneficial. The follow through with sound policies are required which must be understood and supported by the people. But there is good evidence that the generation coming of age at the present time is supportive of moving in the direction of more liberty and self-reliance. The more this change in direction and the solutions become known, the quicker will be the return of optimism. Our job, for those of us who believe that a different system than the one that we have had for the last 100 years, has driven us to this unsustainable crisis, is to be more convincing that there is a wonderful, uncomplicated, and moral system that provides the answers. We had a taste of it in our early history. We need not give up on the notion of advancing this cause. It worked, but we allowed our leaders to concentrate on the material abundance that freedom generates, while ignoring freedom itself. Now we have neither, but the door is open, out of necessity, for an answer. The answer available is based on the Constitution, individual liberty and prohibiting the use of government force to provide privileges and benefits to all special interests. After over 100 years we face a society quite different from the one that was intended by the Founders. In many ways their efforts to protect future generations with the Constitution from this danger has failed. Skeptics, at the time the Constitution was written in 1787, warned us of today’s possible outcome. The insidious nature of the erosion of our liberties and the reassurance our great abundance gave us, allowed the process to evolve into the dangerous period in which we now live. Today we face a dependency on government largesse for almost every need. Our liberties are restricted and government operates outside the rule of law, protecting and rewarding those who buy or coerce government into satisfying their demands. Here are a few examples: Undeclared wars are commonplace. Welfare for the rich and poor is considered an entitlement. The economy is overregulated, overtaxed and grossly distorted by a deeply flawed monetary system. Debt is growing exponentially. The Patriot Act and FISA legislation passed without much debate have resulted in a steady erosion of our 4th Amendment rights. Tragically our government engages in preemptive war, otherwise known as aggression, with no complaints from the American people. The drone warfare we are pursuing worldwide is destined to end badly for us as the hatred builds for innocent lives lost and the international laws flaunted. Once we are financially weakened and militarily challenged, there will be a lot resentment thrown our way. It’s now the law of the land that the military can arrest American citizens, hold them indefinitely, without charges or a trial. Rampant hostility toward free trade is supported by a large number in Washington. Supporters of sanctions, currency manipulation and WTO trade retaliation, call the true free traders “isolationists.” Sanctions are used to punish countries that don’t follow our orders. Bailouts and guarantees for all kinds of misbehavior are routine. Central economic planning through monetary policy, regulations and legislative mandates has been an acceptable policy. Excessive government has created such a mess it prompts many questions: Why are sick people who use medical marijuana put in prison? Why does the federal government restrict the drinking of raw milk? Why can’t Americans manufacturer rope and other products from hemp? Why are Americans not allowed to use gold and silver as legal tender as mandated by the Constitution? Why is Germany concerned enough to consider repatriating their gold held by the FED for her in New York? Is it that the trust in the U.S. and dollar supremacy beginning to wane? Why do our political leaders believe it’s unnecessary to thoroughly audit our own gold? Why can’t Americans decide which type of light bulbs they can buy? Why is the TSA permitted to abuse the rights of any American traveling by air? Why should there be mandatory sentences—even up to life for crimes without victims—as our drug laws require? Why have we allowed the federal government to regulate commodes in our homes? Why is it political suicide for anyone to criticize AIPAC ? Why haven’t we given up on the drug war since it’s an obvious failure and violates the people’s rights? Has nobody noticed that the authorities can’t even keep drugs out of the prisons? How can making our entire society a prison solve the problem? Why do we sacrifice so much getting needlessly involved in border disputes and civil strife around the world and ignore the root cause of the most deadly border in the world-the one between Mexico and the US? Why does Congress willingly give up its prerogatives to the Executive Branch? Why does changing the party in power never change policy? Could it be that the views of both parties are essentially the same? Why did the big banks, the large corporations, and foreign banks and foreign central banks get bailed out in 2008 and the middle class lost their jobs and their homes? Why do so many in the government and the federal officials believe that creating money out of thin air creates wealth? Why do so many accept the deeply flawed principle that government bureaucrats and politicians can protect us from ourselves without totally destroying the principle of liberty? Why can’t people understand that war always destroys wealth and liberty? Why is there so little concern for the Executive Order that gives the President authority to establish a “kill list,” including American citizens, of those targeted for assassination? Why is patriotism thought to be blind loyalty to the government and the politicians who run it, rather than loyalty to the principles of liberty and support for the people? Real patriotism is a willingness to challenge the government when it’s wrong. Why is it is claimed that if people won’t or can’t take care of their own needs, that people in government can do it for them? Why did we ever give the government a safe haven for initiating violence against the people? Why do some members defend free markets, but not civil liberties? Why do some members defend civil liberties but not free markets? Aren’t they the same? Why don’t more defend both economic liberty and personal liberty? Why are there not more individuals who seek to intellectually influence others to bring about positive changes than those who seek power to force others to obey their commands? Why does the use of religion to support a social gospel and preemptive wars, both of which requires authoritarians to use violence, or the threat of violence, go unchallenged? Aggression and forced redistribution of wealth has nothing to do with the teachings of the world great religions. Why do we allow the government and the Federal Reserve to disseminate false information dealing with both economic and foreign policy? Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? Why should anyone be surprised that Congress has no credibility, since there’s such a disconnect between what politicians say and what they do? Is there any explanation for all the deception, the unhappiness, the fear of the future, the loss of confidence in our leaders, the distrust, the anger and frustration? Yes there is, and there’s a way to reverse these attitudes. The negative perceptions are logical and a consequence of bad policies bringing about our problems. Identification of the problems and recognizing the cause allow the proper changes to come easy. Too many people have for too long placed too much confidence and trust in government and not enough in themselves. Fortunately, many are now becoming aware of the seriousness of the gross mistakes of the past several decades. The blame is shared by both political parties. Many Americans now are demanding to hear the plain truth of things and want the demagoguing to stop. Without this first step, solutions are impossible. Seeking the truth and finding the answers in liberty and self-reliance promotes the optimism necessary for restoring prosperity. The task is not that difficult if politics doesn’t get in the way. We have allowed ourselves to get into such a mess for various reasons. Politicians deceive themselves as to how wealth is produced. Excessive confidence is placed in the judgment of politicians and bureaucrats. This replaces the confidence in a free society. Too many in high places of authority became convinced that only they, armed with arbitrary government power, can bring about fairness, while facilitating wealth production. This always proves to be a utopian dream and destroys wealth and liberty. It impoverishes the people and rewards the special interests who end up controlling both political parties. It’s no surprise then that much of what goes on in Washington is driven by aggressive partisanship and power seeking, with philosophic differences being minor. Economic ignorance is commonplace. Keynesianism continues to thrive, although today it is facing healthy and enthusiastic rebuttals. Believers in military Keynesianism and domestic Keynesianism continue to desperately promote their failed policies, as the economy languishes in a deep slumber. Supporters of all government edicts use humanitarian arguments to justify them. Humanitarian arguments are always used to justify government mandates related to the economy, monetary policy, foreign policy, and personal liberty. This is on purpose to make it more difficult to challenge. But, initiating violence for humanitarian reasons is still violence. Good intentions are no excuse and are just as harmful as when people use force with bad intentions. The results are always negative. The immoral use of force is the source of man’s political problems. Sadly, many religious groups, secular organizations, and psychopathic authoritarians endorse government initiated force to change the world. Even when the desired goals are well-intentioned—or especially when well-intentioned—the results are dismal. The good results sought never materialize. The new problems created require even more government force as a solution. The net result is institutionalizing government initiated violence and morally justifying it on humanitarian grounds. This is the same fundamental reason our government uses force for invading other countries at will, central economic planning at home, and the regulation of personal liberty and habits of our citizens. It is rather strange, that unless one has a criminal mind and no respect for other people and their property, no one claims it’s permissible to go into one’s neighbor’s house and tell them how to behave, what they can eat, smoke and drink or how to spend their money. Yet, rarely is it asked why it is morally acceptable that a stranger with a badge and a gun can do the same thing in the name of law and order. Any resistance is met with brute force, fines, taxes, arrests, and even imprisonment. This is done more frequently every day without a proper search warrant. Restraining aggressive behavior is one thing, but legalizing a government monopoly for initiating aggression can only lead to exhausting liberty associated with chaos, anger and the breakdown of civil society. Permitting such authority and expecting saintly behavior from the bureaucrats and the politicians is a pipe dream. We now have a standing army of armed bureaucrats in the TSA, CIA, FBI, Fish and Wildlife, FEMA, IRS, Corp of Engineers, etc. numbering over 100,000. Citizens are guilty until proven innocent in the unconstitutional administrative courts. Government in a free society should have no authority to meddle in social activities or the economic transactions of individuals. Nor should government meddle in the affairs of other nations. All things peaceful, even when controversial, should be permitted. We must reject the notion of prior restraint in economic activity just we do in the area of free speech and religious liberty. But even in these areas government is starting to use a backdoor approach of political correctness to regulate speech-a dangerous trend. Since 9/11 monitoring speech on the internet is now a problem since warrants are no longer required. The Constitution established four federal crimes. Today the experts can’t even agree on how many federal crimes are now on the books—they number into the thousands. No one person can comprehend the enormity of the legal system—especially the tax code. Due to the ill-advised drug war and the endless federal expansion of the criminal code we have over 6 million people under correctional suspension, more than the Soviets ever had, and more than any other nation today, including China. I don’t understand the complacency of the Congress and the willingness to continue their obsession with passing more Federal laws. Mandatory sentencing laws associated with drug laws have compounded our prison problems. The federal register is now 75,000 pages long and the tax code has 72,000 pages, and expands every year. When will the people start shouting, “enough is enough,” and demand Congress cease and desist. Liberty can only be achieved when government is denied the aggressive use of force. If one seeks liberty, a precise type of government is needed. To achieve it, more than lip service is required. A government designed to protect liberty—a natural right—as its sole objective. The people are expected to care for themselves and reject the use of any force for interfering with another person’s liberty. Government is given a strictly limited authority to enforce contracts, property ownership, settle disputes, and defend against foreign aggression. A government that pretends to protect liberty but is granted power to arbitrarily use force over the people and foreign nations. Though the grant of power many times is meant to be small and limited, it inevitably metastasizes into an omnipotent political cancer. This is the problem for which the world has suffered throughout the ages. Though meant to be limited it nevertheless is a 100% sacrifice of a principle that would-be-tyrants find irresistible. It is used vigorously—though incrementally and insidiously. Granting power to government officials always proves the adage that: “power corrupts.” Once government gets a limited concession for the use of force to mold people habits and plan the economy, it causes a steady move toward tyrannical government. Only a revolutionary spirit can reverse the process and deny to the government this arbitrary use of aggression. There’s no in-between. Sacrificing a little liberty for imaginary safety always ends badly. Today’s mess is a result of Americans accepting option #2, even though the Founders attempted to give us Option #1. The results are not good. As our liberties have been eroded our wealth has been consumed. The wealth we see today is based on debt and a foolish willingness on the part of foreigners to take our dollars for goods and services. They then loan them back to us to perpetuate our debt system. It’s amazing that it has worked for this long but the impasse in Washington, in solving our problems indicate that many are starting to understand the seriousness of the world -wide debt crisis and the dangers we face. The longer this process continues the harsher the outcome will be. Many are now acknowledging that a financial crisis looms but few understand it’s, in reality, a moral crisis. It’s the moral crisis that has allowed our liberties to be undermined and permits the exponential growth of illegal government power. Without a clear understanding of the nature of the crisis it will be difficult to prevent a steady march toward tyranny and the poverty that will accompany it. Ultimately, the people have to decide which form of government they want; option #1 or option #2. There is no other choice. Claiming there is a choice of a “little” tyranny is like describing pregnancy as a “touch of pregnancy.” It is a myth to believe that a mixture of free markets and government central economic planning is a worthy compromise. What we see today is a result of that type of thinking. And the results speak for themselves. American now suffers from a culture of violence. It’s easy to reject the initiation of violence against one’s neighbor but it’s ironic that the people arbitrarily and freely anoint government officials with monopoly power to initiate violence against the American people—practically at will. Because it’s the government that initiates force, most people accept it as being legitimate. Those who exert the force have no sense of guilt. It is believed by too many that governments are morally justified in initiating force supposedly to “do good.” They incorrectly believe that this authority has come from the “consent of the people.” The minority, or victims of government violence never consented to suffer the abuse of government mandates, even when dictated by the majority. Victims of TSA excesses never consented to this abuse. This attitude has given us a policy of initiating war to “do good,” as well. It is claimed that war, to prevent war for noble purposes, is justified. This is similar to what we were once told that: “destroying a village to save a village” was justified. It was said by a US Secretary of State that the loss of 500,000 Iraqis, mostly children, in the 1990s, as a result of American bombs and sanctions, was “worth it” to achieve the “good” we brought to the Iraqi people. And look at the mess that Iraq is in today. Government use of force to mold social and economic behavior at home and abroad has justified individuals using force on their own terms. The fact that violence by government is seen as morally justified, is the reason why violence will increase when the big financial crisis hits and becomes a political crisis as well. First, we recognize that individuals shouldn’t initiate violence, then we give the authority to government. Eventually, the immoral use of government violence, when things goes badly, will be used to justify an individual’s “right” to do the same thing. Neither the government nor individuals have the moral right to initiate violence against another yet we are moving toward the day when both will claim this authority. If this cycle is not reversed society will break down. When needs are pressing, conditions deteriorate and rights become relative to the demands and the whims of the majority. It’s then not a great leap for individuals to take it upon themselves to use violence to get what they claim is theirs. As the economy deteriorates and the wealth discrepancies increase—as are already occurring— violence increases as those in need take it in their own hands to get what they believe is theirs. They will not wait for a government rescue program. When government officials wield power over others to bail out the special interests, even with disastrous results to the average citizen, they feel no guilt for the harm they do. Those who take us into undeclared wars with many casualties resulting, never lose sleep over the death and destruction their bad decisions caused. They are convinced that what they do is morally justified, and the fact that many suffer just can’t be helped. When the street criminals do the same thing, they too have no remorse, believing they are only taking what is rightfully theirs. All moral standards become relative. Whether it’s bailouts, privileges, government subsidies or benefits for some from inflating a currency, it’s all part of a process justified by a philosophy of forced redistribution of wealth. Violence, or a threat of such, is the instrument required and unfortunately is of little concern of most members of Congress. Some argue it’s only a matter of “fairness” that those in need are cared for. There are two problems with this. First, the principle is used to provide a greater amount of benefits to the rich than the poor. Second, no one seems to be concerned about whether or not it’s fair to those who end up paying for the benefits. The costs are usually placed on the backs of the middle class and are hidden from the public eye. Too many people believe government handouts are free, like printing money out of thin air, and there is no cost. That deception is coming to an end. The bills are coming due and that’s what the economic slowdown is all about. Sadly, we have become accustomed to living with the illegitimate use of force by government. It is the tool for telling the people how to live, what to eat and drink, what to read and how to spend their money. To develop a truly free society, the issue of initiating force must be understood and rejected. Granting to government even a small amount of force is a dangerous concession. Our Constitution, which was intended to limit government power and abuse, has failed. The Founders warned that a free society depends on a virtuous and moral people. The current crisis reflects that their concerns were justified. Most politicians and pundits are aware of the problems we face but spend all their time in trying to reform government. The sad part is that the suggested reforms almost always lead to less freedom and the importance of a virtuous and moral people is either ignored, or not understood. The new reforms serve only to further undermine liberty. The compounding effect has given us this steady erosion of liberty and the massive expansion of debt. The real question is: if it is liberty we seek, should most of the emphasis be placed on government reform or trying to understand what “a virtuous and moral people” means and how to promote it. The Constitution has not prevented the people from demanding handouts for both rich and poor in their efforts to reform the government, while ignoring the principles of a free society. All branches of our government today are controlled by individuals who use their power to undermine liberty and enhance the welfare/warfare state-and frequently their own wealth and power. If the people are unhappy with the government performance it must be recognized that government is merely a reflection of an immoral society that rejected a moral government of constitutional limitations of power and love of freedom. If this is the problem all the tinkering with thousands of pages of new laws and regulations will do nothing to solve the problem. It is self-evident that our freedoms have been severely limited and the apparent prosperity we still have, is nothing more than leftover wealth from a previous time. This fictitious wealth based on debt and benefits from a false trust in our currency and credit, will play havoc with our society when the bills come due. This means that the full consequence of our lost liberties is yet to be felt. But that illusion is now ending. Reversing a downward spiral depends on accepting a new approach. Expect the rapidly expanding homeschooling movement to play a significant role in the revolutionary reforms needed to build a free society with Constitutional protections. We cannot expect a Federal government controlled school system to provide the intellectual ammunition to combat the dangerous growth of government that threatens our liberties. The internet will provide the alternative to the government/media complex that controls the news and most political propaganda. This is why it’s essential that the internet remains free of government regulation. Many of our religious institutions and secular organizations support greater dependency on the state by supporting war, welfare and corporatism and ignore the need for a virtuous people. I never believed that the world or our country could be made more free by politicians, if the people had no desire for freedom. Under the current circumstances the most we can hope to achieve in the political process is to use it as a podium to reach the people to alert them of the nature of the crisis and the importance of their need to assume responsibility for themselves, if it is liberty that they truly seek. Without this, a constitutionally protected free society is impossible. If this is true, our individual goal in life ought to be for us to seek virtue and excellence and recognize that self-esteem and happiness only comes from using one’s natural ability, in the most productive manner possible, according to one’s own talents. Productivity and creativity are the true source of personal satisfaction. Freedom, and not dependency, provides the environment needed to achieve these goals. Government cannot do this for us; it only gets in the way. When the government gets involved, the goal becomes a bailout or a subsidy and these cannot provide a sense of personal achievement. Achieving legislative power and political influence should not be our goal. Most of the change, if it is to come, will not come from the politicians, but rather from individuals, family, friends, intellectual leaders and our religious institutions. The solution can only come from rejecting the use of coercion, compulsion, government commands, and aggressive force, to mold social and economic behavior. Without accepting these restraints, inevitably the consensus will be to allow the government to mandate economic equality and obedience to the politicians who gain power and promote an environment that smothers the freedoms of everyone. It is then that the responsible individuals who seek excellence and self-esteem by being self-reliance and productive, become the true victims. What are the greatest dangers that the American people face today and impede the goal of a free society? There are five. 1. The continuous attack on our civil liberties which threatens the rule of law and our ability to resist the onrush of tyranny. 2. Violent anti-Americanism that has engulfed the world. Because the phenomenon of “blow-back” is not understood or denied, our foreign policy is destined to keep us involved in many wars that we have no business being in. National bankruptcy and a greater threat to our national security will result. 3. The ease in which we go to war, without a declaration by Congress, but accepting international authority from the UN or NATO even for preemptive wars, otherwise known as aggression. 4. A financial political crisis as a consequence of excessive debt, unfunded liabilities, spending, bailouts, and gross discrepancy in wealth distribution going from the middle class to the rich. The danger of central economic planning, by the Federal Reserve must be understood. 5. World government taking over local and US sovereignty by getting involved in the issues of war, welfare, trade, banking, a world currency, taxes, property ownership, and private ownership of guns. Happily, there is an answer for these very dangerous trends. What a wonderful world it would be if everyone accepted the simple moral premise of rejecting all acts of aggression. The retort to such a suggestion is always: it’s too simplistic, too idealistic, impractical, naïve, utopian, dangerous, and unrealistic to strive for such an ideal. The answer to that is that for thousands of years the acceptance of government force, to rule over the people, at the sacrifice of liberty, was considered moral and the only available option for achieving peace and prosperity. What could be more utopian than that myth—considering the results especially looking at the state sponsored killing, by nearly every government during the 20th Century, estimated to be in the hundreds of millions. It’s time to reconsider this grant of authority to the state. No good has ever come from granting monopoly power to the state to use aggression against the people to arbitrarily mold human behavior. Such power, when left unchecked, becomes the seed of an ugly tyranny. This method of governance has been adequately tested, and the results are in: reality dictates we try liberty. The idealism of non-aggression and rejecting all offensive use of force should be tried. The idealism of government sanctioned violence has been abused throughout history and is the primary source of poverty and war. The theory of a society being based on individual freedom has been around for a long time. It’s time to take a bold step and actually permit it by advancing this cause, rather than taking a step backwards as some would like us to do. Today the principle of habeas corpus, established when King John signed the Magna Carta in 1215, is under attack. There’s every reason to believe that a renewed effort with the use of the internet that we can instead advance the cause of liberty by spreading an uncensored message that will serve to rein in government authority and challenge the obsession with war and welfare. What I’m talking about is a system of government guided by the moral principles of peace and tolerance. The Founders were convinced that a free society could not exist without a moral people. Just writing rules won’t work if the people choose to ignore them. Today the rule of law written in the Constitution has little meaning for most Americans, especially those who work in Washington DC. Benjamin Franklin claimed “only a virtuous people are capable of freedom.” John Adams concurred: “Our Constitution was made for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.” A moral people must reject all violence in an effort to mold people’s beliefs or habits. A society that boos or ridicules the Golden Rule is not a moral society. All great religions endorse the Golden Rule. The same moral standards that individuals are required to follow should apply to all government officials. They cannot be exempt. The ultimate solution is not in the hands of the government. The solution falls on each and every individual, with guidance from family, friends and community. The #1 responsibility for each of us is to change ourselves with hope that others will follow. This is of greater importance than working on changing the government; that is secondary to promoting a virtuous society. If we can achieve this, then the government will change. It doesn’t mean that political action or holding office has no value. At times it does nudge policy in the right direction. But what is true is that when seeking office is done for personal aggrandizement, money or power, it becomes useless if not harmful. When political action is taken for the right reasons it’s easy to understand why compromise should be avoided. It also becomes clear why progress is best achieved by working with coalitions, which bring people together, without anyone sacrificing his principles. Political action, to be truly beneficial, must be directed toward changing the hearts and minds of the people, recognizing that it’s the virtue and morality of the people that allow liberty to flourish. The Constitution or more laws per se, have no value if the people’s attitudes aren’t changed. To achieve liberty and peace, two powerful human emotions have to be overcome. Number one is “envy” which leads to hate and class warfare. Number two is “intolerance” which leads to bigoted and judgmental policies. These emotions must be replaced with a much better understanding of love, compassion, tolerance and free market economics. Freedom, when understood, brings people together. When tried, freedom is popular. The problem we have faced over the years has been that economic interventionists are swayed by envy, whereas social interventionists are swayed by intolerance of habits and lifestyles. The misunderstanding that tolerance is an endorsement of certain activities, motivates many to legislate moral standards which should only be set by individuals making their own choices. Both sides use force to deal with these misplaced emotions. Both are authoritarians. Neither endorses voluntarism. Both views ought to be rejected. I have come to one firm conviction after these many years of trying to figure out “the plain truth of things.” The best chance for achieving peace and prosperity, for the maximum number of people world-wide, is to pursue the cause of LIBERTY. If you find this to be a worthwhile message, spread it throughout the land.

God bless you Israel. For my part, don't stop. Wipe them out. Adopt a Conan policy. Crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentation of their women. [IMG]http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg296/Amest_wow/Conan_the_Barbarian_150.jpg[/IMG]

Screw it, I'm posting A lot of people that took that same oath believe the current regime to be a domestic threat. Just letting you know that there's people, including vets, that would push that issue both ways. I'm recently discharged, and I can tell you a lot of newer vets, as well as active duty, won't obey unlawful orders from a corrupt Socialist Regime. [quote name='DaveTN' timestamp='1352830771' post='844883'] Yep and they won't be dead martyrs or Patriots; they will just be dead terrorists. I took the oath, and if you want to change my country you will do it at the polling place because if you try it by force you will lose. [/quote] Funny thing is they called Washington and all the other founding fathers terrorist, traitors and worse. Remember history is written by the victor of the battle.

I know I don’t need to explain myself and not really sure it matters to some of you why I did what I did but here goes. First off let me start by saying that we are a family oriented site and do our best to maintain that image. And sometimes in order to maintain that image some posts do need to be edited or deleted. It happens regularly and 99% of the time it goes unnoticed by the members here. As far as why I deleted the link it was not emotion driven, at least not when I deleted it. Yes, as the thread dragged on I did get a bit emotional about it just like many other members here. And just because I am a moderator here does not mean I have to or that I even need to turn off my emotions and become a moderating zombie of sorts. Anyone who has come to me with a problem knows I have a true concern for them and their problems. Without any emotion, as some of you have suggested I should be, I would not be able to do that. I truly am concerned for everyone on this board like any family. Remember that care, concern and compassion are emotions just like disgust is an emotion. For me the link was not a gun or 2[sup]nd[/sup] amendment issue even though it morphed into that. Anyone who knows me knows I am pro gun. Again, for me the link was not a gun rights issue but a domestic violence issue. When it was posted and I first saw it I had two options. Leave it or remove it. Trust me when I say I struggled with it for a bit. Then I realized there really isn’t a gray area when it comes to domestic violence or the abusers themselves. If I were to leave it up then by inference anyone who might come and visit this board might see me, as well as the board, as supporting domestic violence and the damage it does. Remember, people are not going to see the petition as a gun rights issue but as a domestic violence issue. They might also view the members here who didn’t speak out against it as supporting domestic violence in some way. And I, for one, do not want to be associated with or be accused of supporting anything related to domestic violence. Now on the other hand if I removed the link this is what would happen. It prevents anyone who might come and visit the site from ever questioning the stance the board has on domestic violence. And by deleting it that would also show it how we, as the TGO family, feel about domestic violence. So for me I felt that by leaving it up nothing good could come of it. Remember this is not a gun issue but a domestic violence issue. Domestic violence is a violent crime that has serious, long term emotional and sometimes physical effects on the victims. It affects their self esteem, self worth, confidence but most importantly it also affects those who are most likely to witness it, the children. Children mimic what they see and will grow up to do the same thing their parents have taught them. This only perpetuates the domestic violence problem. And I would hope we all agree that domestic violence is heinous and uncalled for under any circumstance. And we all should distance ourselves from anything that can be viewed as a pro domestic violence stance. Remember, a person with [u]ONE[/u] post came on here with an agenda. He was either trying to garner support for his own, individual situation that we have no clue about or he was just trolling to create turmoil amongst our TGO family. Either way it seems like a complete stranger has been successful on one or both counts. I do not hold grudges, I do not hate and I try to treat everyone here equally. Besides my memory is so bad that I wouldn’t be able to remember who I have a grudge against and who I don’t so I just don’t hold a grudge. Those that reported me I am not upset or out to get you. I welcome anyone who feels there is a problem with the board to hit the report button so we can address it, not just for you but for everyone. I just needed to get this out there for people to see my reasoning. Please do not turn this into the same discussion as the previous thread, that is not why I posted this. Dolomite

[quote name='gregintenn' timestamp='1353019952' post='846218'] I remember the world was going to end new year's 2000, when Bush was elected, etc. It isn't good, but this too will pass. [/quote] LOL. You're house can get termites and that will pass too. You won't have a house left if you do nothing, but, hey...it [i]will[/i] pass. Interestingly, I keep reading letters and emails from people who escaped [u]to[/u] the United States from countries like Cuba, Russia, Poland, Nazi Germany, etc. They say that what they see going on scares them to death and mirrors what went on in those countries when people were saying that it was no big deal. Those of us old enough to have lived history remember what happened, unlike many who can only read whitewashed versions of history. I fear for my country, but I guess I can know that I lived during the pinnacle of the United States and was personally there to witness her greatness. Glad I'm not very young and have to live 60-80 more years if people think everything will just fix itself. Have fun with that. I often fantasize what it would be like if you had a time machine and could go back to 1938 and warn people about Hitler, or any other pre-war era. I always come to the same conclusion that it wouldn't work. People back then tried to warn others, they were laughed to scorn, so why would they listen to the guy with the time machine? They wouldn't.

Ok, so many of us here believe the Obammunist and his minions are low down evil and dangerous thugs who will stop at nothing to fulfill their evil designs on us and the United States. So, why would you put your name on a list that says you think he's an Evil Bastard and that he'd stop at nothing to destroy the U.S.? Are you going to use your real name and address? If you think he'd stop at nothing, he wouldn't stop himself and his minions from knocking on your door in the middle of the night, collecting you and your family barefoot in their nightshirts and hauling you off in the back of a five-ton truck to a barbed wire compound in the middle of North Dakota. It would probably be smarter to sign up at one of the ObamaLove websites, learn the Worshipful Songs and the Secret Handshakes, all the while keeping your powder dry in a vault in your back yard and waiting for The Signal.

What about discharging a firearm inside city limits? Reckless endangerment? Dectruction of property? Someone needs to come up with every single charge they can think of and throw them all at this guy. Put him under the jail.

I would also like to add this: "We the people have the authority according to America’s Declaration of Independence, which states:[indent] [b]That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government[/b], laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience has shown that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. [b]But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.[/b]"[/indent] These are the principles upon which this country was built. These principles which will be the battle cry for future patriots, of which there will be many. If it comes down to it, the sheep will call those who fight for the betterment of the country through revolution "terrorist". But God willing, the history books will call them [color=#ff0000][b]Patriots[/b][/color].

Wow, just wow. While I do not advocate for either civil disobedience or secession, those that are promoting it do not wish for the country to be destroyed. So, who exactly are you guys threatening? Sheesh. From my reading, if the country ever goes to total s**t where a situation like this occurs, heaven forbid, you will not have millions of veterans behind you. More than likely they will be on the side of the people.

No need to explain yourself brother. You were chosen for a reason. Hey people, remember its not a democracy here. Keep up the good work.

[quote name='OhShoot' timestamp='1353037066' post='846358'] They're tapered, need to come out from left to right:[/quote] Don't get caught up in "left to right" or "right to left" when it comes to taper pins. I have seen plenty that had to be tapped out the opposite direction of what they were "supposed" to go out. Always look for the [i][b]smaller[/b][/i] end of the pin, and tap it out from that side. The pins may come easily, other times..........not so much. If they are difficult, put some penetrating oil on them and let them set for a while, then try again.

[quote name='RevScottie' timestamp='1353015334' post='846176'] It seems funny with all of this in depth political analysis on abortion, religion, gay marriage, war mongering, blue laws, etc, where everyone is supposed to realize the Republican party is going to have to compromise no one feels that way about gun rights. Much of the country see's no need for high capacity magazines and assault rifles yet that is political suicide for a Republican to accept compromise there. What we are saying is its OK for compromise on anything that really isn't important to me. [/quote] The big difference IMO is that firearms are specifically protected but the US constitution while the others mentioned are not even mentioned. Firearms shouldn't be a political issue one way or the other. Actually neither should abortion, gay marriage, or religion, those are issues of morality which the government has no business dictating one way or the next.

[quote name='sigbrown1297' timestamp='1352942247' post='845826'] i know nothing about deer hunting. All i know is that they taste great and i would like to get a couple deer to fill a freezer. My brother in law has a little bit of land where he said i could hunt. I know you have to have a license and looked at the TWRA website and saw the info about limits and all. I don't want to invest in a lot of money in equipment and camo, and stands. What the best way to go about this. Also i don't know how to field dress a deer so I'm a little worry about what I do after it shoot one. [/quote] Contrary to what Cabela's, Gander Mountain, etc would have you believe it doesn't have to be expensive at all. One you get licenses and hunter safety out of the way you don't NEED a ton of stuff. If I were starting from scratch and on a budget I would buy a Mosin Nagant and some decent hunting rounds for it if you don't already have a suitable gun. Besides that buy a good knife if you don't have one and a cushion to sit on. You won't need camo since you are wearing orange anyway, just wear something comfortable. A good rifle, a good knife, and some patience/ knowledge of local deer habits are all you will need to put one in the freezer. Best of luck. I think I could easily get into the woods for well under $200.

My tops are usually shot at that time as well. I'd guess around $40 for a resole, but that is strictly a guess. A call to your local shoe repair store would probably in order to know for sure.

[quote name='101' timestamp='1353014625' post='846169'] I'm going to play devils advocate here. I'm not going to get into a p*ssing contest with anyone, just offering a different point of view. First thing I noticed is all the evil death wishes and bad karma being hoped upon the gentleman in question. Y'all sound like a bunch of tree hugging liberals. So sad. I understand that some people place pets on a higher stool than most of their family members. That, also sad. Plus, the story stated that the neighbor had a previous pet. My gut tells me the neighbors were much like mine. They have been told time and time and time again to keep their damn dog in their own yard. Yet, the neighbors continue to thumb their nose at him, much like mine do. The owner admitted to letting the dog out first with no leash. My guess is she had no intentions of putting the dog on the leash at all. Even being a puppy, that puppy has enough energy and weight to cause harm to someone who is old. So I can't say I don't blame him for putting an end to a problem that has probably been a problem for alot longer than the news is reporting. My neighbor's dog is a pitbull/hound dog mix and is extremely aggressive, yet my neighbor let's it run free all the time, even after numerous talks with me. I'm about to have a child and I would not hesitate to shoot that dog if I thought for one second it was too close to my kid, wife or myself. Don't burn me too bad. I'm not saying he was right, I'm just saying maybe he wasn't entirely wrong. [/quote] Jebus.. we are not talking about a 50 lbs pit or pit mix here ..it was 3 lbs dog.. thats less weight than a coon or a possum.. We might sound like treehugging liberals but you sound like an ass... So sad!!!

I remember the world was going to end new year's 2000, when Bush was elected, etc. It isn't good, but this too will pass.

I believe this worthless POS shot the puppy because he was mad at the neighbor. The puppy was not a threat to him or anyone on his property.

I learned about the boiling, see my above post with warm water. I don't mean to be rude either, in case that came across as being rude.

[quote name='101' timestamp='1353014625' post='846169'] Don't burn me too bad. I'm not saying he was right, I'm just saying maybe he wasn't entirely wrong. [/quote] He was entirely wrong. It was a friggin min-pin. He might as well have been afraid of a teacup poodle. If you have a problem with the neighbors dog in your yard, as long as it isn't attacking anyone you have any number of options. Call animal control. Pop it with a frickin BB gun. You don't go shooting a gun in a residential neighborhood for a non life-threatening situation.

IMO When you got kids that injure or kill pet animals, the various authorities put them on a list and start watching them, as it's a Very Bad Sign. Sometimes kids then move onto injuring or killing people. Harming animals is a Warning. I imagine the same thing would apply to adults. When you have an adult that injures or kills pet animals, I imagine the various authorities put them on a list and start watching them, as it's a Very Bad Sign. Harming animals is a Warning. I believe this Evil Man is going to start collecting traffic tickets left and right, get charged with littering, fined over an unkempt lawn, have difficulty cashing checks, and potentially lose custody of kids or grandkids. You can be pretty sure every neighbor around him is going to be watching him like a hawk. If he gets himself into a shouting match with one of his neighbors, or at Wal-Mart, he could end up with an assault charge. Responding officers would find the prior incident with the dog and he'd lose any benefit of the doubt and the officer would be more likely to cuff, stuff and transport him. He has not gotten away with anything, and he has not done himself any favors. Folks might not want to hear this, but the little dog may have accomplished a Last and Noble Mission, sacrificing its life to point out an Evil Man, and perhaps saving the life of other people by warning us all. God put the animals on this earth to serve us, and sacrifices like this are a part of the Divine Service of Animals. Grieving for the little dog is a marker of your own personal quality and your desire to protect the least among us. IMO

6.8 makes several good points in his post above (...#72..) here. My take on all this is that im a relatively old coot (...66...) and ive never seen as much divisiveness (...other than the vietnam thing...) and grousing about the sorryness of government than ive been hearing and seeing for the last four years. This current crop of idiots has managed to drive the wedge deeper and drag the issues further down the road quicker with their high handed tactics than ive ever seen before. They have re-opened wounds between the government, the people, and the individual states that were inflicted via the bayonet in the post civil war period. They shouldn't have done that. When these issues are re-visited; i predict that there will not be enough carpetbaggers and thugs to enforce much of what they dream of doing. Further, they dont have an army of occupation to enforce this stuff. I predict (...and sincerely hope and pray...) they will loose bad in court. Otherwise, there could be some trouble. When you have otherwise solid citizens talking succession and have third partys like the Tea Party(s) in various states talkin about the things they are talkin about; with bad words dricted toward both political parties and the government; those in those parties and the political operatives need to be concerned. RE: Violence directed toward those in government. The nobama regieme and its operatives dont need to worry about violent harm comming from the "Rs" and the various freedom loving groups. For the most part, those groups are law abiding citizens who work for a living, and are genuinely concerned about the direction the country is being taken in. The politicos need to be worried about their far left socialist bastard brothers and commie philistine harlot sisters who dont think that they are doin enough to bring the beautiful utopian socialist paradise to the good ole usa. Remember, Jared Loughner aint a right wing nut; he is a left wing nut. leroy

If you convert a Saiga AND properly do the front end the dollar amount is fairly even if not a little ahead with the Arsenal. You have to add in the refinishing and proper parts. Are they worth it? Yes and no. Do you get a "better gun (reliability, function, etc.?) with an Arsenal .... no. Do you get a fully complete and properly factory built AK that is top shelf for a fair deal? Yes. Would I buy an Arsenal? No. I'd go with the Saiga and make it exactly the way I want it. If I wanted a historically correct traditional AK that I wasn't going to change anything on, I'd get the Arsenal. It's all in what you want. Six of one 1/2 dozen of the other.

There are advantages and disadvantages to each, but I will say this, if you ever do some night time force on force training and you'll understand why I no longer use weapon lights on any of my weapons. I have learned that stealth is the key to surviving/winning low/no light gun fights.

He needs to be charged with animal cruelty as well. Then they need to take his social security while he is in jail, which it should be anyways, as well as while he is on probation. How ironic would it be that he could only afford dog or cat food to eat. Then require him to do his community service at a local animal shelter cleaning up their crap. And finally he needs to be required to walk next door every single day and appologize to the children until they find another dog. I hate that this happens and I wish the old man could feel some of the parent's pain. I mean it is so heart wrenching as a parent to watch your child be miserable over something. What makes it worse is when you cannot do anything to fix it. The parent(s) are strong people for not kicking the old man's ass and they probably did that for their kids to see how to be responsible. The old man is a weak minded individual that probably thinks he is entitled to do stuff like this because he is old. Being old doesn't give you the right to something like this, nothing does. Dolomite

Hey Ramjo, Nothing wrong with selling your barrel and buying a factory but threading isn't that bad. I do it for $50. A new threaded .920 barrel is going to run you easily $120+ for the cheaper ones. But yeah, the .920s look very nice with a Sparrow, Quest, Outback type 22 suppressor. I did a 10/22 tactical for my son a few years ago and with a quest, you couldn't tell where the barrel ended and the suppressor started. It was pretty slick. I have a stainless .920 in the shop if you're in the area you could look at. Be happy to help with the threading too. Or, if you're interested in a stainless bull model, this one I have in the shop was brand new. Took it to a demo a few weeks ago... < 20-30 rounds through it. I'd take $50 and your barrel in trade if you want it. I have a used quest suppressor in the shop as well. Have some Sparrows on order but the ATF is dragging here lately. Good luck, the 10/22s are excellent suppressed weapons.

http://youtu.be/I3yvFmi_q1M "Hey man, nice shot."

[quote name='Symbolic' timestamp='1352912314' post='845512'] Honestly, I don't know a whole lot about Gore's legislation so I cannot say much about it. Politicians are motivated by profits so I'm always suspicious of them. They will say and do whatever it takes to get more money. What I do know is that carbon pollution is a real threat and it has real consequences. Coal, although not the only fuel, is cheap and plentiful and a great source of energy, but it is dirty. I think a carbon tax is a good thing because industries need to take responsibility for the damage they're causing with carbon pollution. I hope this isn't a bad exmaple: Your neighbor continuously waters his lawn so much that it floods yours. The water gets into your garage, your yard is mud, and your wife can't grow any flowers in the yard. Would you tell him to stop? Hopefully with the taxes collected from industrial pollution, we can fund projects and research to clean up this mess whether it concerns the industries, the land, or the people. However, with politicians that usually isn't the case. It seems like no one is truly for the people anymore. When I went to college, I didn't know what I wanted to do or study so I chose Environmental Science. The courses I took along with the research we conducted changed my view on people and life on this planet. While the work I do doesn't have anything to do with my degree, the lessons I learned still work on me. Edited for grammar. [/quote] You are a Carbon based life form. You exhale Carbon. I think a carbon tax on [u][i]you[/i][/u] is a good thing because [i][u]you[/u][/i] need to take responsibility for the damage [u][i]you're[/i][/u] causing with carbon pollution. FTFY.

aah, who cares who they pick. Does anyone really think someone suitable to a group of people on a gun board will be chosen?

Short of violence, short of expecting our corrupt Attorney General to evenhandedly enforce the law, I'm not exactly sure what legal options are open to us regarding an uncorrupted, legitimate election. I'd be willing to get heavily involved personally and even financially in a route that would tend to correct the problem, short of violence, on a national level. I'm not even sure if there is any longer a reputable voter registration program. My understanding is even the once-neutral(?) League of Women Voters has been co-opted and corrupted. I'm thinking if one party distributes and collects voter registration materials, they throw out voter registrations that come back with the other party marked. I'm not quite ready to take a rifle up in the hills ala Red Dawn, but I'm getting kind of concerned about locking onto alternative means to start correcting the problem that is short of physical. It seems that if one side is going to push and shove and get confrontational, you know, descending to mob behavior, that one of the few routes left is to get just as physical and confrontational back. I'd sure like to get Voter ID tightened up, but I'm thinking that even that route will be very confrontational. I think confrontation is a last resort. You know work inside the system and all that. Tennessee's system could be better but other states are downright pitiful and corrupt beyond measure. If you have a voting system that's corrupt, who's going to trust it, who's going to abide by the results? It'll start to mean less and less, and people won't let it solve things because it's corrupt. There are still folks that pretend there isn't a problem because they know their side gets an advantage and they refuse to have an honest opinion about it. To what end? When does the talk come to an end and the shoving back begin? I'm thinking we're getting closer and closer. I've still got quite a bit of shove left in me, but I hate to let it out, it's so hard to put it back in the box. You really don't want to see me angry, it sends the children scurrying, makes my wife cry, and the neighbors get wide-eyed before they shut and lock the door.

Just shy of secession, states rights, state sovereignty and nullification are our last best hope for saving the nation. It is one of the checks and balances built into our government, it's just not one we've used often enough to remember it. If Mr. Haslam will refrain from setting up insurance exchanges, refrain from expanding medicare coverage there's nothing the feds can do to make us get on obamacare, it's in the SCOTUS opinion, read it. And for your reading enjoyment here is a small excerpt from said SCOTUS rulling: [left][size=4][font=Courier New][i]The Framers thus ensured that powers which "in the ordinary course of affairs, concern the lives, liberties, and properties of the people were held by governments more local and more accountable than a distant federal bureaucracy. The independent power of the States also serves as a check on the power of the Federal Government: 'By denying anyone government complete jurisdiction over all the concerns of public life, federalism protects the liberty of the individual from arbitrary power' ... In the typical case we look to the States to defend their prerogatives by adopting 'the simple expedient of not yielding' to federal blandishments when they do not want to embrace the federal policies as their own. [/i][/font][b][font=Courier New][u][i]The States are separate and independent sovereigns. Sometimes they have to act like it."[/i][/u][/font][/b][/size][/left] Looks to me like even though we might not have agreed with the obamacare rulling, the justices said: "here you go boys, it's in your court now." There's not a better time to begin flexing our sovereign mite than now. And one last FYI, if obamacare is the law in TN, any of you with individual insurance policies can expect those premiums to double because of the new rules obamacare requires. Chances are you'll be jumping on the government insurance bandwagon toot-sweet. How does that feel?

[quote name='OhShoot' timestamp='1352926572' post='845679'] Most of the world loves Obama. Only in the US are his favorable ratings anywhere near as low as 50%. - OS[/quote] They loved his Apology Tour. The countries we've thrown countless dollars at don't like us, and the other countries are envious of us - until Obama's goal of cutting us down to size is accomplished.

[quote name='JayC' timestamp='1352905579' post='845432'] ,,,,,Recent history doesn't seem to support your argument, look at the break up of the Soviet Union... States were allowed to leave and form their own countries, and while all of that happened under a massive economic turmoil... trade didn't stop, cross board travel didn't stop, and life went on in a crappy way...[/quote] I don't think that's a valid analogy. A long complicated affair, but basically Mother Russia kept granting more and more autonomy to its SSRs and eventually cut them loose via it's own prerogative. All spurred by systemic economic failure. So far, Mother USA (Washington, DC) is still tightening control over its states. Perhaps once we totally fail economically as did the USSR, something similar might occur. But what results wouldn't be 50 individual nation states, but regional countries. Like the United South East, Confederation of Mountain States, Rust Belt Federation, New England Union, Pacific Pact, whatever. Might reform into a looser national confederation for trade purposes just as the current CIS that replaced the USSR. Hmm, maybe it wouldn't be so bad. - OS

I swear, I wish a lot of you would really lighten up on the matter. No, I am talking about those who have petitioned for secession. I do not wish for secession, and I am willing to bet that the vast majority of those who are espousing it do not want it either. Why are they asking for it if they don't really mean it? It is a cry for help, nothing more. Honestly, I think it is a plea to the state legislatures to do something to stop the nonsense coming from Washington. A lot of Americans are seeing dramatic changes in their country for the worse, and they feel helpless to do anything about it. For example, their vote is becoming meaningless. In 2010, with the help of the Tea Party, Republicans regained control of the house to put a stop to the Obama and socialist Democrats agenda. Did it work? No. There were numerous occasions where the Republicans could have stopped a lot of this crap, which they were elected to do, via the power of the purse and they didn't do a damn thing. You can also look at recent comments from Speaker Boehner. It was total capitulation. I could go on and on with page after page of examples. Sheesh, I don't even want to go into all the crap and malfeasance that happened during this election cycle. Instead of secession, what a lot of people should be asking for is that their state legislatures start using nullification. We have seen a few cases of this in the past. California's pot shops would be a great example. California basically told the federal government to get bent in regards to California's leniency on pot and their pot shops. I can't recall an incident where you had a band of federal agents rounding up and arresting all of those people who were in clear violation of federal law. I could be wrong, but I believe it is incendiary rhetoric from both sides of any issue that typically make matters worse.

Wooden arrows and a compund bow sound like a recipe for disaster to me. WTSHTF do you really want half an arrow shaft through your forearm? The one problem I have with The Walking Dead is Daryl making arrows from wood for his compound bow. Sure it can be done, but not easily and only a few choice species of wood will hold up. The cheap wooden arrows that are most commonly found are nothing but a fletched and nocked dowel rod. Just be careful. This could be one of those cry now or REALLY cry later moments.

[quote name='crimsonaudio' timestamp='1352840578' post='844984']Where were all you guys who are so pissed about losing your rights when the Patriot Act was enacted (or the three further authorizations)? I'm no Obama-apologist, but it strikes me as odd that none of this 'liberty or death' talk was heard when Bush was in office.[/quote] They were on the internet bitching and moaning, talking about making the world a better place with the next election, and the one after that, and the one after that...

[quote name='LINKS2K' timestamp='1352852032' post='845090'] I'm not attempting to carry water, blow or piss in the wind. Republicans or democrats, whoever wants to raise hell because they do not get their way is just being childish. Stupidity has no party or color. [/quote]You have been implying that Republicans are wanting to "raise hell", but that is just not the case, there is not one shred of evidence pointing to that, it just doesn't exist. Trying to lump Republicans in with the like of Democrats who have actually called for violence just doesn't work. If you are going to defend the USA and the Constitution as you stated in the opening post, I can tell you now that you won't be defending them from Republicans.

My brother shoots a T/C and was having the same problems with pellets @ 150gr. He dropped down to 100 and it is as accurate as can be now.

[quote name='LINKS2K' timestamp='1352830299' post='844880'] Obamas admistration is bad. Worth civil unrest? No! [/quote] Not sure where you're coming from, I can only infer which group you are attempting to speak to, but... if Romney had won there would have already been riots in the streets, looting, violence perpetrated on caucasians and more. Already. It would be past tense or still be ongoing. Since 0bama "won", things are relatively calm and peaceful. That's because the group that "lost" is the more mature, reasonable, cautious group, the group that acts with honor and abides by the law, regardless of the circumstances. So I'm not sure which group you are saying that are "[color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Wanting to destroy OUR country because you didn't get your way in a election is STUPID!" I don't hear anyone talking about that. The side that "won" will do a plenty good job of destroying the country as it is.[/font][/color]

It has nothing to do with being a sore loser, hell I don't even like Romney. It has to do with watching the current regime strip away rights as quickly and quietly as they can while people stand by. Would Romney have been a better choice? I don't know. I do know Obama has proven he cares nothing about constitutional rights and will sneak, and slide, and push things through anyway he can, including being the first President to ever make buying something from a third party mandatory. In 4 years this will be may still be The United States of America. But it'll never be the same one again. And I honestly believe that in 4 years, it will take a military action to remove Obama from the White House.

As much as I hate what the country is becoming we are far from being a third world ####hole. And if we did secede the state would become a third world ####hole in a matter of days. The federal government would not invade us or try to beat us into submission. They would lock our border down and not allow anything in or out. Then they would just starve us into submission and then we would be begging to go back to the way it was before. And guess what, we will be way worse off that what we are now. We cannot support our own population without the help of the other states and if we secede the feds will not allow interstate commerce with us any more. And if you think you will be going to work as usual it will be kind of hard to do that without any gas because it will no longer be imported. Your job won't matter anyway because companies here will go out of business when they cannot sell their items out of state or get supplies in from out of state. We would ALL loose our jobs because no other state still under federal control would be allowed to do business with us. Look at all the food that is imported into the state from other states as well as other countries. Those food items will be gone in days and all food normally imported will stop at the border. So all of you wanting to secede are willing to risk your own family starving? Then there is the medicine that will stop at the border. How many here are diabetic or have loved ones that are? They will be dead in months if they stocked up. But realistically they would probably starve before then because if they are not stockpiling medicine they do not have food stockpiled. This goes right along with those who are planning to bug out to the hills. They, and those wanting to secede, have not thought out the long term ramifications of it. I do not want to secede for a few reasons. First is everything I mentioned above. But also if we secede we no longer have a voice and we will have zero chance of effecting change in the federal government. If you want things to change write letters, make calls and send emails to your representative. How many here did that before the election or any time they disagree with something their representative does? I know I have wrote trying to influence their decisions. It is not too late. We will have the most important elections in the next few years. If we loose the majority in congress, which we probably will unless something is done, the democrats will forever change this nation. I said it before and I will say it again. Be careful what you wish for, you might actually get it. If you are truly patriotic to this country you should not be wanting to leave it but fight for it. Dolomite

[quote name='enfield' timestamp='1352778317' post='844654'] Some day we'll be their biggest problem, and they're well aware of that fact. [/quote] I think they're well aware of that possibility. I also think they're not dumb enough to trigger it.

A question that may be a bit off track. If it's a liberal Zombie would it eat you or would you have to feed yourself to it? : Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk 2

[quote name='seez52' timestamp='1352745895' post='844359'] There was nothing great about Mr. Lincoln other than he presided over the greatest killing of Americans in history. Oh, and he ushered in the foundations of what has us in the unfortunate place we now find ourselves. [/quote]There was nothing honorable in the practice of slavery nor was there anything honorable in brothers taking up arms against their brothers. The Civil War was not Lincoln's fault; it was just his problem to deal with...we have a Constitution and a rule of law so that we don't have to have civil wars to solve our problems; I hope we don't forget that again.

Ridiculous.

I wouldn't toss any mags... I'd simply buy new springs.

Im really tired of hearing about Reagan.

I have thought about it and when I get my next lower or two I will immediately assemble them in pistol configuration. Then I will take a picture with the receipt from that day in the pistol configuration. I might also have the news on in the background so it can't be said I found an older newspaper. I am glad they changed the law and it is a relatively recent development in the scheme of things. Dolomite

This. The actual State of TN requirement is that 70 percent of all the holes have to be in the black and touching the silhouette, no matter how little, counts as in the black. The target is a B-52 is pretty large. Someone has already mentioned this, but some instructors grade using the scoring rings, but that isn't specifically required by the State. Unrelated to the OP: The sad part is, occassionally, someone (while I was still doing classes) would fail the shooting portion. The ironic, yet funny to me part is, it was almost always the guy with the biggest attitude because he already knew everything. In the last class I taught, I heard a guy tell his wife, and I quote, "Don't pay any attention to their BS about how to shoot. I've been shooting all my life and that ain't how I do it, and I know what I'm doing." ...and yep, you guessed it, he wouldn't listen to anything we told him, and he scored a 62 or 64. His wilfe listened to what we told her, and she scored a 100. Of course, being the good instructor, I had to point it out to him.

Yeah, what seems to be the official course target has no head ring. Similar to this except in black: 'Course, instructor can call whatever he wants as good I reckon; it's not like there's an oversight committee or anything. - OS