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No matter what the caliber people don't like getting shot. In a scenario of criminal activity resulting in violence an intruder is most likely gonna try to bail on the sound of gunfire alone. Crimes of passion are going to increase the likelihood of continued advance even after being wounded. Clearly in this case when the gun came out these guys fled. It wouldn't have mattered if it was a .22 or blunderbuss. The only difference may have been how fast the perp died. I'm sure this is true in most cases of SD shootings that don't involve passion or emotion. So yes, a .22 is quite capable of fending off an attacker even if it doesn't incapacitate them. For someone opposed to carrying such small caliber weapons it is most likely because they don't want to give the attacker the opportunity to make that choice because there is still a chance the perp will not decide to stop... I am one of those folks. That don't mean I don't recognize that bad guys don't like being shot at or shot, and will most likely take the first "out" they can find; and I do have personal experience on that subject to support my conclusion.

Well BK, I would say your crystal ball is working just fine

http://www.tennessea...ext|FRONTPAGE|s "Police have increased area patrols of the mall and they recommend steps such as retaining possession of items like purses, GPS units, and laptop computers when leaving the vehicle." Noticeably absent is the mention of firearms. Since I can't carry mine inside the mall, then I have to leave it in my car for someone to steal. This is exactly WHY I don't go to the mall.

I saw two interesting Glocks today, one I ended up getting. First off a fella I met today had a Gen 2 22 that was engraved as a Detroit PD pistol. I hadn't seen one of these before although I have a Metropolitan Police District of Columbia Gen 2 G17 myself as well as a Warner Robbins PD 3rd Gen 19. The guy with the Detroit PD gun wanted to sell it but I told him that tngunowners might give him a wider audience, as would glocktalk. I personally do not have any interest in .40 S&W. However, today I did acquire a very nice Gen 2 G19 today that another TGO member used to own.

President of the TN Chamber of Commerce gives us her .02: http://www.tennessea...ext|FRONTPAGE|s One of the comments raises a good point about how government steps all over private property rights in regards to the handicapped, racial quotas, etc. Yet somehow a law that allows employees to keep their firearms locked in their vehicles is telling businesses what to do? Can you say "double standard"? ROFL

NB Forrest, I appreciate the comment. You have really moved to the next level and above mine in shooting ability. I think El Guapo designed a fun match for us and anyone of a half dozen of us could have won it. I knew it would come down to who could shoot it with the least mistakes, as far as I’m concern it was you .... Till we meet again. I also appreciate the other support I have received in this thread, by PM and email. IBTL

Awhh come on why stop now. This is getting better than Springer. Sent from my SCH-I510 using Tapatalk

The rule of have "members only" parking at a club is not the Issue here in my opinion . Paying your money (in this case 30.00) to shoot a match and then having someone pull your score sheet after the match is over and never telling you that this could happen is poor judgement and the issue here. If I don't park in the right spot tell me face to face that you are going to keep my money and my score sheet then I will decide to move, shoot or communicate. If a shooter breaks a safety rule or some other DQ'able offense, more power to you. The shooter deserves to forfeit match fees and scores and hopefully no one got hurt. If someone parks in wrong spot and get what amounts to a DQ, whats next? Wear the wrong color shirt and get kicked of the range forever? Seems a bit over the top.

Well, it certainly seems like this thread is going to fix the club's parking problem....

On the following thread, http://www.tngunowners.com/forums/topic/45676-did-you-take-to-the-polls-today/ someone was down voting all those who voted for Paul and up voting everyone who voted for Santorum. I just checked the thread again, and it has changed. Either a moderator took care of it, or someone up voted all of those who voted for Paul to reset to zero. I really don't like that crap. It is very childish.

Hate knife threads without pix. Spydie Military: Great knife for sure. Carried the Camo one for a good while, will probably periodically go back to it. I prefer 3.5 - 4" blades for main carry knife. But always have my Buck Stockman for normal tasks -- it's mostly what the citizens see. Currently carrying a Chink Kershaw Tremor, just to prove I'm not a snob. Really do like it, and have gotten hooked on the assisted opening. Also a Buck Vantage Force Avid, even though it's only 3.25". Also very much like the Cold Steel 4" Voyager, both older and new model. I want my main carry knife to have a decent point on it. Even my last ditch stand necker follows that advice (Meyerco Law Dog): - OS

Bagging it. Almost did, since I'm embarrassed to have Goody Two Shoes Pope Boy carry TN, but what the heck, looks like they'll split the delegates and it'll still be Mitt in the general. - OS

Voted Rick.

I'm truly sorry that you are taking all this so personally. Maybe it would do you good to just step back and take a deep breath. I have never been in a self-defense situation nor do I want to be. I hope that makes you happy. It's been my experience that those who are the most adamant that mouseguns will get the job done are the same ones who like to ignore the ballistic evidence to the contrary. So, ballistics do play a major role in your odds of survival, like it or not.

I'm not trying to put words in your mouth, unlike some other forum members. You DID say that the chances of having to use a firearm in self-defense is slim, did you not? And I would never try to take someone's right away to carry any weapon, underpowered or not. I am not arguing the .22's effectiveness in this case. What I am arguing is its CONSISTENT effectiveness as opposed to other choices. That's all. However, some folks are resistant to the idea of having the best odds of survival for some unknown reason.

We're not talking about every situation. NO gun is adequate for EVERY situation.

Bottom line, I've read more stories of folks successfully defending themselves with small caliber weapons than stories of someone being overtaken by the person they just shot with a mousegun. I'm sure if such statistics existed it would show such a marginal percentage of that actually happening. Paired with the slim chance of having to fire your weapon in self defense in the first place, I'd say that a mousegun is about as likely to get you killed as being attacked by a shark in Utah.

A lot of people also think that every bad guy will wet his pants at the sound of a 12 gauge shell being chambered, but there have been instances where that wasn't the case. If a .22 is all someone can handle, then it's definitely better than nothing. Does that mean that it will do the job? I dunno.

Gee, I'm disappointed. I thought for sure since you put so much weight on first hand experiences that you would willingly tell me about your own. After all, it's you who's making it an issue, not me.

Bingo. It's all about having the best possible chance to survive. I don't want a jellyfish thrown on my face either, but that doesn't make it a good defensive choice. All the "it's better than nothing" arguments are ridiculous from the viewpoint that it's not "either/or". No one HAS to choose something that isn't proven to be CONSISTENTLY effective.

Regale me with your experience about stopping a threat with a .22 or any other mousegun caliber, since you're all about "experiences".

No ridicule, just observation. I didn't say anything about anyone else not knowing what they were talking about, and yes, you seem to be all butt hurt because someone is challenging your assertion about the wisdom of depending on a .22 for self defense. Show me where I said YOU didn't understand. Go ahead. Let's see some proof about consistency of sub-service calibers. Go ahead. You have the floor.

My experiences don't change anything, and neither do yours. Facts are facts. Do the research for yourself. And if you want to shoot to kill, instead of stopping the threat, by all means, carry a .22. Have at it. Show me the proof that sub-service calibers CONSISTENTLY perform as well as service calibers, and I'll consider adding a mousegun to my arsenal. Go ahead. I'll wait.

Voted today for RP. The wife won't tell me who she voted for.

Ridicule doesn't make a very good argument. I haven't advocated carrying howitzers or anything else extreme.

That's why I carry a desert eagle .50 and a sawed off 12 gauge as backup. If that doesn't work I have a backup 2 ft long bowie knife running the length of my leg. Anyone that carries anything smaller is just asking to be a victim.

Voted early for Santorum.

Just a few minutes ago. Santorum.

Voted this morning...Santorum

This is why you carry the weapon on you and why you have a chain or something else on the door to "help" prevent someone from entering while answering the door....

Not much sense in saving yourself to only loose your Humanity...

I would gladly buy my GF a .22LR if she would carry it. Better than nothing. I sure as hell wouldn't want to be shot with a .22

No, Dale had morals. Dale wasn't preaching some hippie ####. He was preaching the truth. Just because you don't pull the trigger, doesn't make you innocent. In that situation, I would have likely done the same thing Rick did. Act all big and tough but not be able to pull the trigger. Its not easy to kill a man. And you are talking like you do it daily. I hope that everyone of you that takes Shane's side is the first to go if there is ever a real apocalypse situation because I certainly don't want to deal with your crap. Why? Why is it the way of things? Why MUST the kid be judged based on NO ACTIONS? They know nothing about him other than he was with a group that was willing to kill (Doesn't mean he is) and that he knows where the farm is. We haven't seen him kill anyone or harm anyone and yet all of you are ready to chop the guy's head off. Thats not survival, its cruelty and it shouldn't be tolerated. You can be cautious with a newcomer and make them prove themselves and thats fine but what you are doing is just flat out homicide whether its a civilized society or not.

Bull####! First, he never took a never kill "things" stance. He only took a don't kill the living stance. And I agree with him 100 percent. Secondly, how does that stance mean that he needs to die?

Anyone who doesn't have the ability to contact friends or family for help, is one who is a user and more than likely not to be trusted.

Now to this point, from 1796 to 1870, the Constitution of Tennessee gave an unequivocal Right to every non-criminal to keep and bear arms for the common defense, (and common defense includes personal defense in any discussion of rational people) it was the carpetbagging Republican Party that re-wrote the Article to give power to the legislature to restrict the wearing of arms, and instituted the "intent to go armed" clause of the TCA, primarily to forbid the freed slaves from being able to carry arms, so the restriction put the ability to bear arms firmly ensconced into the ruling elite's purvey.

Not that this hasn't been argued ad nauseum on this forum, but where does it say that in the constitution?The Declaration of Independence doesn't say anything about property when they talk about the unalienable rights. In fact it says, "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness." Gee, Life is listed first indicating highest priority, because without life nothing else matters. Then there's the sticky little "We The People of The United States," that says nothing about businesses.

I stopped by the Dept. this AM, & spoke with the Sheriff & Chief Dep. They said Cooley made it thru the night pretty well. Has quite a bit of drainage from the wounds. He can squeeze your hand when you talk to him, according to the Chief. Best news....he survived. Difficult road ahead at best. He's young & tough. A big thanks to everyone for all the well wishes. Know he'll appreciate it.