The Lead Thread

[Caster]

There's been a bit of interest as of late with home rolled ammo. Casting your own bullets is an awesome hobby and if you enjoy the time spent, it can save you a fortune. It ain't easy and even a bit daunting at first. I was lost in woods like hansel & gretel when I got started. With no one to guide me I jumped in feet first and started treading water.

Let start this off by saying that I know others do things differently and I know some things I do may not be right as considered by the status quo of experts out there. As such I implore you to not go upon my word but research and not make decisions lightly.

Here we go.

Our tale begins with the object of many a bullet casters desire. Wheel weights.

All wheel weights are not created equal. First I like to separate the stick on wheel weights. They are softer and work awesome for slugs, shot, and muzzle loaders. Second is non lead. You will find all manner of things from stick ons made of rubber and steel to clip ons marked FE which are steel or iron. Trash them. Next is the bane of aluminum molds existence. Zinc.

Although aluminum melts at very high temps it can be dissolved in molten zinc much like salt will dissolve in hot water. Don't mess with this crap. It ain't worth the trouble you'll get. A good rule I use is a pair of pruning shears.

If you can't cut it easily trash it.

Moving on.

Caster ain't fancy so laugh if you like. A simple hot plate with a goodwill pot and a cover pan to hold smoke and heat in works fine.

Fill it with weights, crank it up to high, cover and wait.

When the fumes get rolling go stir it. I use a stainless steel table spoon.

A word of caution. Don't breath this mess. You're just gonna have to trust me on that. I use a painters respirator with the replaceable charcoal filters.

Now, it's melted. Stir a bit and start scooping off the crap.

Gently scoop off the sludge and

refuse.

I use old coffee cans to dump the mess in and when full toss it in the scrap metal bin.

Next is a step many don't do but I do. It's cheap and easy and it's added insurance against contaminants getting in my bullets. Fluxing at the smelting stage. Using a bit of paraffin I flux the lead before it goes to ingots and again when I remelt it for casting. I like to take a candle and hold it to my hot spoon and let the wax melt into the spoon, then stir it in. Watch out, the paraffin will ignite.

Stir through the flames making sure to scrape the sides and bottom. Let the lead sit a minute or three to recoup some heat lost. Now we pour into ingots. You can buy an ingot mold or get creative. Just be sure you ingots fit in the casting pot you plan to use. Personally I think smaller is better as it's easy to add more but hard to add less on a big ingot. I use a goodwill bought muffin tin.

There you go. Finished ingots. Let them cool and they're ready to store. Be careful. Don't do anything stupid and don't get burnt.

[Caster]

Okay, we have some decisions to make here. What do we want to cast and for what purpose? These decisions dictate where we go next so let's keep it simple. How about my XD9?

Let's say inexpensive range/blastin' ammo huh? Okay. What bullet? How do we choose? I like to go with something simple, effective and even though it's not a very professional approach, I like to start with something that appeals to me. SO, our mold here will be a Lee 124g truncated cone (2) cavity mold.

There's a few things I like to do to the mold right out of the box. First, go ahead and take the spru plate off. With a flat, clean, fine hone stone, go ahead and gently stone the bottom side of the spru plate.

We're not sharpening a hatchet here we just want it free of burrs and smooth. Now wrap a rubber band around the handles to keep them closed and GENTLY stone off the face of the mold.

Now open the mold and use a toothbrush and solvent to scrub the mold and plate clean. Look for obvious burrs in the cavities and with a fine instrument remove them. Now get you a box of wood matches. We're going to "smoke" the mold. This will help it release better and drop a better filled out bullet. Light a match and holding it so the tip of the flame kisses the inside of the cavity, move it around until there is an even covering of soot in the whole cavity. It should take about one match per cavity half. Got it? Good. Close the mold and now we are going to put a super small dab of anti seize in the spru plate screw hole. A super super small amount on the plate hole too but not too much or it will melt and run into the cavity. That's a pain to clean. We just want it smooth and so that it won't gall when it gets hot.

Alright. Let's see. We'll need some tools. A mold mallet. I turned mine from a piece of Osage orange.

A ladle.

A lead furnace. I like the Lyman here with rheostatic temp control.

And since we are doing 9mm we'll want the bullets pretty hard so we are going to water quench them. I use a coffee can half full of water.

Hey guys. Don't make me say I told you so. Keep the water away from molten lead. Please.

Let's fire up the lead pot and get started.

Edited January 26, 2012 by Caster

[Caster]

Okay boyo's let's do what we came here to do. Lets make us some zombie death pills!

Safety is YOUR responsibility!!! Understand that because I'm not going to repeat it again. If you get toasted, don't start pointing your burnt stump at Caster. He told you not to screw around!

The pot is hot. The ingots are melted. Remember the part about fluxing? Yeah, do it again. And again if something don't feel right. Cleanliness is important. Do you want a crusty booger that might have silica or ferrous material tear microscopic gouges out of your precious with every bang?

Okay. Make sure your ladle is clean and dry and stick it in the pot to get warmed up. I like to prop my mold up on there too to soak up some heat. Giver a sec to get warm.

Okay, pour the cavities full leaving a small puddle on top. It's very important to learn to get that right. Too little and the base of the bullet will not fill out. Too much transfers unnecessary heat, makes a mess and makes you look like a goon. Just cuz we rednecks don't mean we can't be professional.

Now watch the puddle. See it change shades. Never open a mold while it's shiny you'll smear lead and/or tear a chunk from the base of the bullet. it should turn kinda dull, it'll look like a magic trick as it changes:) Like wise you don't wanna wait too long. If you see a plug torn from the base it's no good. That void will cause leading. A smooth flat base will hold while the powder burns but hot gases will push into the void and vaporize lead during ignition. It also causes inconsistent weights and uneven pressure on the bullet. All this affect accuracy.

Some people hammer open the spru. They've done it for eons who am I to say different.....but I don't. I use an opened vise. Hold the mold by the handles, insert the spru head in the opening and pull.

Reason I do this is two fold. First I'd rather not beat the crap out of my molds. It's unnecessary. Two is I want a smooth shearing action to give me the smoothest base possible. A smooth flat base is priority number one. And while we are on the subject of not beating up our molds. Never hit the mold body. Use your mallet to hit the hinge bolt on the mold handles to drop stuck stubborn bullets. And we do that over the water can. Just let them plunk right on in.

Do it gently now and don't let the water splash. Also when, and it will happen, a drop of water hits the mold, wait until it quits sizzling. Pour molten lead in a cavity where there's water boiling and the steam will pop like a little firecracker which will make a bad bullet, scare the pee out of you and possibly pop hot lead on you. Don't do that.

Well, how many you cast here is up to you, your patience and your supply. Don't worry about wrinkles and what not. Just learn the ropes. All bad bullets can be remelted until you get it right. Take this time to just learn and feel what's happening.

I will say this. Cast two or three and drop them on a towel and let them air cool. We want them softer and in the continuing saga you'll see why.

[Caster]

Moving right along. Break down that pistol and pour some oil down the barrel.

Remember the bullets we cast and air cooled? You didn't lose them did you? Drop one nose first into the chamber.

Gently drive it through.

You should only fell real resistance the first half inch as the rifling engraves upon the bullet. You should be able to lightly peck it on through. What you DON'T want is to pound it. You want it to spin through the barrel as it would if fired. Now measure the bullets major diameter. Add.001-.002 to that and select the appropriate sizer. Many is the time that the figure you get is the as cast diameter. If its on the undersize there is a fix for that. I will address this if there's interest, later as it is a bit involved.

Still with me? Now we tumble lube. In the interest of my tiring patience I will say there are great YouTube videos on this. Just follow the directions. I use an old plastic coffee can. They don't need to be heavily coated. A light coat is fine for anything under a thousand to 1100 fps. Go heavy if you like. It won't hurt a thing but it will smoke like a black powder pistol if you get them too heavy. My first loads were heavily lubed and loaded with unique. Unique is a touch smokey anyway. I could empty a ten round mag real fast and could barely see the target by the last shot. You'll figure it out. That's the fun of handloading.

I also, contrary to many, like to dump my freshly lubed bullets on a plastic sheet and using a pair of hemostats, stand them up. Reason being, some lube will run down into the micro bands and when dry there won't be clumps on the sides.

Wait 24 hours and load them up. Be sure when you load them to flare the case enough. After they are loaded ready to go, you may wanna wipe off the bullet so the dried lube doesn't build up in the gun. That gets labor intensive, but I do it. If you don't, you'll just have to clean it out of the gun. Revolvers need not worry.

Now for you Lee factory crimp die users, try this: load an unsized bullet in a case and run it through the FCD. Now use a kinetic hammer to pull it back out. Measure it and compare. If it's close to what your original figured dimension was, try shooting 50 and look for leading. Hey, works for me. It will save you a step too.

I know I left gaps in information. I know you all got questions. Lets keep this thread on topic & nail down some definitive steps for those interested in getting started. I've had lots of PM's recently and love to answer questions. But I fear answering the same questions repeatedly will cheat some folks out of a proper answer as I get sloppy or in a hurry. That's not fair and it's rude.

I will answer here, any relevant question on the matter. If I dont know it. We will find it.

My fingers are tired and I need a beer. Y'all be safe whatever you do, please!

[Westwindmike]

Wow Caster. Great lesson for all new casters!

[Caster]

Wow Caster. Great lesson for all new casters!

Thanks, I know you've cast a boolit or two so jump in anytime. Other experienced casters too. Jump in and tell the fledgling castalytes the great secrets. One wall I wanna see tore down is the "hiding" of information. Some of the old school geezers are loathe to give up what makes their cast loads a one ragged hole on paper.Join us brothers and sisters. I welcome everyone to a casting revival.

If you need convincing, the above pistol shoots a load I developed just for it. Range pick up brass and my lead is well......as cheap as cheap gets. I load it for $55/thousand. Beat that. You can get really close or right on it if you're crafty and smart.

Edited January 26, 2012 by Caster

[Guest pfries]

Great info Caster, about how much harder does the water quenching make the boolit?

[Guest canebreaker]

Well done Caster.

We need a sticky here!

[Caster]

Great info Caster, about how much harder does the water quenching make the boolit?

That's a complicated subject too. I know of one particular brand of wheel weight that I can get 20-22 brinnell That's seriously tough. I have actually fired a 45acp cast from this and water quenched in ice water twice. I fired it into a phone book, dug it out and it was no worse for wear, I re-lubed it and loaded it again. It was too far undersize to try again but in a pinch it could have went a third time...maybe. I wouldn't really wanna try.

The average WW ought to be 14 or so brinnel when water cooled. Maybe higher. I may be wrong here but it's my understanding that it's not the lead that hardening. Lead cannot harden itself, but it's the antimony, arsenic, tin and other goodies in WW's that harden. The lead is just along for the ride. As much as I have fooled with metals in my time, it makes sense to me.

I will tell you what will happen though. If you try to put too much thought into hardness numbers and the applications thereof, you will go stark raving mad. Melt them weights, cast them boolits and drop them in cool water.

Ohh, on long casting sessions, change that water every few hundred. I've gotten a second wind rolling before and really been on fire casting away and the water in the can be so hot you could shave in it. The trick is to cool it all at once, so change your water, OR use a bigger bucket. I've even used a 5 gallon bucket when I've been on a casting binge and put a few trays of ice in with the water. I think I cast around 5 or 6 thousand that week.

[jtmaze]

Yes we do. Not in a position to start right now but hopefully in the near future.

JTM🔫

Sent from my iPhone

[jtmaze]

That's a complicated subject too. I know of one particular brand of wheel weight that I can get 20-22 brinnell That's seriously tough. I have actually fired a 45acp cast from this and water quenched in ice water twice. I fired it into a phone book, dug it out and it was no worse for wear, I re-lubed it and loaded it again. It was too far undersize to try again but in a pinch it could have went a third time...maybe. I wouldn't really wanna try.

The average WW ought to be 14 or so brinnel when water cooled. Maybe higher. I may be wrong here but it's my understanding that it's not the lead that hardening. Lead cannot harden itself, but it's the antimony, arsenic, tin and other goodies in WW's that harden. The lead is just along for the ride. As much as I have fooled with metals in my time, it makes sense to me.

I will tell you what will happen though. If you try to put too much thought into hardness numbers and the applications thereof, you will go stark raving mad. Melt them weights, cast them boolits and drop them in cool water.

Ohh, on long casting sessions, change that water every few hundred. I've gotten a second wind rolling before and really been on fire casting away and the water in the can be so hot you could shave in it. The trick is to cool it all at once, so change your water, OR use a bigger bucket. I've even used a 5 gallon bucket when I've been on a casting binge and put a few trays of ice in with the water. I think I cast around 5 or 6 thousand that week.

How does that compare to say 22lr that is a lead bullet in hardness.

JTM🔫

Sent from my iPhone

[Guest canebreaker]

Miss fire lead head 22lr that I've removed the boolit and combined them with my other lead is soft. I'd say pure lead.

[Caster]

Yeah. It's dead soft.

[Caster]

So, I've been thinking maybe we need a "Casting Co-Op"

There's so many boolits out there, but it sucks when you buy a mold only to discover, you don't like the results you get. Here's a proposal I'll start myself. I'd be happy to cast a hundred or so [That's plenty to see if you and your gun like them] in exchange for like amounts of something I don't have. Anyone interested, just let me know. I'll get a list of what molds I have up soon.

[Caster]

Well, while you lazy bums were lounging about, claiming need to rest or whatever lame excuse you use, I busied myself at the bench today. I started off early, turing ingots into a nice pile of usables.

I then proceed to turn those into .308's. This load is VERY accurate, brass lasts for dozens and dozens of loadings....I'm guessing, I have yet to wear any out and this lot has been fired MANY times. All this at a total out of pocket expense of about 9 to 10 cents each.

[Caster]

Moving on while I was motivated, I loaded some for the blackhawk.

[Caster]

Finished up by loading some more .45's and reassembling my PT145. I FINALLY found a trigger for it that would work on gunbroker and ordered the slide stop spring. Taurus wouldn't sell me one.

I even whipped up some pimpin' cool brass pins for it. Yeah they look bad. I've gotta order some stainless to make some more. They'll do for now.

[Jamie Jackson]

Excellent tutorial, great pics, and solid info!

Thank you for taking the time Caster.

[Caster]

Where is everybody? Everyone wants to find ammo cheaper, I'm sittin' here tellin' you how to make it cheaper....

Lead is more expensive than ever and you can STILL save money here. The above pic of the .45 acp was loaded with a 200g bullet I cast, pan lubed with bullet lube that I make, using range pick up brass and bullseye. It's a very light but snappy little round and in all honesty, it's about the most accurate load I have ever run through the Taurus. Wish I could convince a few of you [local] guys to get into it. I meant what I said about CoOp working together. I love to cast and I'll bet you a dollar I have more time to cast in a day than most of you

[Guest canebreaker]

Caster, where you be? Middle, TN, where's the range?

We did 1,000 rounds per weekend at stones river range for a while, but that's out now.

I have lots of stock waiting for some shooting.

[Caster]

Williamson County. I shoot at CHMR mostly.

[Guest canebreaker]

Do they have a website?

[I_Like_Pie]

I'll bet I have 600 pounds of casting lead in my basement waiting for when I have a day off and it isn't raining to produce everything I need for the year's shooting. It won't take more than 50-60# to get though this year due to being so busy at work.

Caster....love those .311 bullets. They look to be alox rings with a gas check!?!? Is that right?

[Caster]

I'll bet I have 600 pounds of casting lead in my basement waiting for when I have a day off and it isn't raining to produce everything I need for the year's shooting. It won't take more than 50-60# to get though this year due to being so busy at work.

Caster....love those .311 bullets. They look to be alox rings with a gas check!?!? Is that right?

That's right. They shoot incredibly well. I load them over Unique strictly for my Ishapore 2A. Accuracy is very good and recoil is an absolute joke. I have a CZ chambered in .223 that has more recoil and about three times the muzzle blast. I would never do it extensively, but you could shoot these loads with no ear plugs and never have a ringing ear. I probably will never do anything with it but bust clay targets, but it is an absolute joy to do so with. They explode like a pipe bomb from the slow moving lead slug too.

I know what you mean about being busy. I've made some changes to NOT be so busy this year. I've worked hard for the last few years ferreting away quite a bit, especially 9mm. I plan to burn the bulk of it this year. I will be shooting a lot more this year, getting better with this new Glock and I'm trying to work out taking Advanced Handgun I at the Range Inc. this summer.

Edited February 21, 2012 by Caster

[Caster]

Do they have a website?

http://chmr.us/CHMR/Home.html